people on benefits ..

[benny59]

Im not usually one for getting involved in these "debates". Whilst I feel a certain sense of injustice that these people are able to live off handouts while I struggle to pay the bills, I know that it will not affect me in the slightest possible way if this person is "grassed up" or not.

For those of you who are complaining about this coming directly from your taxes:
Do you think you will get a rebate if benefit cheats are held to account?

I personally think not, the government will find an alternative way to waste your hard earned.

edcase

like they always do m8

 

[benny59]

then why bother contributing?

We have laws in the UK that define fraud, you cant pick and choose which parts of the law you choose to obey and then complain when it happens to you.

then whats your little fiddle karym6 ?? you dont mean to tell me "you have never broken the law

 

[mozr]

First of all hamba, I like you, and the way you post so I will try and reply in a manner deserving of your intellect and character.

I don't see any of the dilemmas or dichotomies Mozr is talking about.

The dichotomy I referred to was in IANB's assertion that he 'hates grasses' which is a definite negative statement. He did qualify it with the allowance that in some cases he would grass. I just wanted to point out that no one on here hates all forms of grasses. There are exceptions.

If you seriously suspect a child is being abused, or a similar act of violence, then you should find out as much as you can as quick as you can and, if you then still fear for the safety of the abused, report it to the police.

True. I do sort of regret using that analogy. It still holds logical weight though. It was in a response karym6's idea of being 100% sure.

If you or your wife are attacked on the street then you are the victim and/or the witness to a crime and should report it to the police.

Agreed. But that would be 'grassing'. So one would have to hate oneself then. That was my point.

That is very different to making assumptions about the source of someones income and the state of their health based on flimsy evidence and hearsay.

I was not comparing the two. I was using the murder analogy to explain that in certain circumstance 'grassing' is acceptable to everybody on here. We just draw the line at a different place.

It becomes even sillier when those assumptions are taken up by others who don't know any of the facts first hand but are going on the say of someone the don't know.

Could you construct a scenario that allowed a private citizen to know 100% that a person was committing benefit fraud? That would be interesting reading.

 

[Napster]

keep it carm chaps please

 

[benny59]

and whats your little fiddle mozr ?? you cant be as white as the way you write

 

[benny59]

Right now? I am not on the fiddle, as you put it, for anything.

Dont download pirate music of films, dont download games. Not ripping off a cable company etc.

A lot of the people I know, work and live with are not doing it either, so that doesnt make me a one off. I even asked the new guy opposite me and he isnt doing anything like this either.

Of course this doesnt mean I havent downloaded stuff in the past before, of course I have. And years ago I chipped a PSX - but so what? I am not doing anything illegal now, so I fail to see your point. Are you asking "have I downloaded stuff before illegally"? Then yes I have, but im not doing it now and have no intention to. Likewise, I have no intention of being a benefits cheat or infact break any laws intentionally.

Basically, I fail to see your point.

hahaha, yes but you have in the past

 

[Rat]

we have ALL done something underhand surely lol

so none of you guys have taken cash without declaring it ? even a days work

for a m8 who bunged you a few quid for helping him out ?

 

[benny59]

Right now? I am not on the fiddle, as you put it, for anything.

Dont download pirate music of films, dont download games. Not ripping off a cable company etc.

A lot of the people I know, work and live with are not doing it either, so that doesnt make me a one off. I even asked the new guy opposite me and he isnt doing anything like this either.

Of course this doesnt mean I havent downloaded stuff in the past before, of course I have. And years ago I chipped a PSX - but so what? I am not doing anything illegal now, so I fail to see your point. Are you asking "have I downloaded stuff before illegally"? Then yes I have, but im not doing it now and have no intention to. Likewise, I have no intention of being a benefits cheat or infact break any laws intentionally.

Basically, I fail to see your point.

i dont have to make a point m8 {people reading this come to thier own conclusions}

 

[mozr]

and whats your little fiddle mozr ?? you cant be as white as the way you write

I download stuff, and got a dreambox.

I've already stated this when RABP tried to do the moral equivalency thing.

It is not the same.

If it is, then anyone who does something illegal is not allowed to criticize any other illegality; a person who downloads an mp3 is not allowed to criticize a murderer. Do you see? When you apply reductionist logic to the matter it becomes absurd.

There are shades of grey in life. My shade is different to yours. You turn a blind eye to the countries resources being squandered on benefit cheats (yes I know the government are bad too etc etc). I do not.

 

[jaffa]

I have lived next door to the guy since 1998 - and I know for a fact he has not worked in that period (he is 42 years old) and I also know from a few sources who know him very well that he has cheated the benefit system by claiming for money he is not entitled to (including his wife as well).

So your sources know the facts not you ???

other information I have had, a old guy died last year down the road, the son of the dead guy got the house of his dad, the next door guy went over to see him and was willing to buy the property in cash (the dead guys son told me this). So where is all this money coming from I have to ask and no he is not a drug dealer etc.

Again your sources told you, if they told you they suspected him of being a drug dealer would you then suspect him of that ???

I know he has not be truthful on his benefits application and gets more than he is entitled, but now it does seem what ever he is up to he as amassed a large volume of cash.

I know alot of people in my area to do this benefit fraud

Do you really know m8 or is that neighbourly gossip again ???

Why have you not already reported all the others if it has been going on for so long and you know for sure ???

If you are know these facts then do what you feel comfortable to do and if that includes reporting him then thats your choice.

I am not criticising anyones choice to report people if they are sure of their facts, I just choose not to do it myself because my taxes pay for people to do the job of hunting down the real benefits fraudsters but if people want to help then out...thats their choice.

 

[benny59]

that makes no sense at all, if you are not trying to form a point then its just words to make up space.

I read your post and didnt see the point of it - why ask what illegal activities people are involved in on a forum that does not condone illegal activities? Seems a little bit contrary to the nature of the word community.

makes sense to me and no doubt other people aswell m8

dont write your posts asif your holyer than the pope m8, {mozr does}

 

[Munkey]

my neighbour has just put a planning permission for an extension to the house, it will cost him about 55K (as the one I did this year cost 45 and his is bigger extension)

now this guy is on benefits doesnt work at all. has a 53 plate people carrier - so how can he afford such an investment in his property ? when he is on benefits ? Is he working with cash in hand and not telling the benefits people.

I work and my wife yet at times we have to watch what we spend as with cost of living and owning a car going up.

rant over

LOL I can't believe most of the guys jumped down your throat for making such an observation. If the guy is genuinely on benefits then there is no way that he can afford such luxuries. Even if he had an imaginary monetary windfall he would have to declare it and thus his benefit situation would change.

You can't be on welfare and afford such items and I seriously doubt he has put the extension on his credit card like some of the ridiculous suggestions about how he could be living outside of his means and thus affording such luxuries.

People should use their common sense. How many times do you go to the supermarket and all the disabled bays are full of cars with people that look like they have nothing wrong with them (well they seem to have no problem carrying 50 cans of tesco branded booze under one arm and 7 kids under the other)

The OP is trying to have a rant and blow some steam, it seems to me that he will need to rant elsewhere about the reaction he has received to his perfectly reasonable rant.

 

[mozr]

Munkey!

Finally someone of sanity comes to my aide.

And benny. I am the pope, that's why!

 

[jaffa]

You can't be on welfare and afford such items and I seriously doubt he has put the extension on his credit card like some of the ridiculous suggestions about how he could be living outside of his means and thus affording such luxuries.

I think earthslayer would disagree with you there (post 255). I can't disagree because I don't know but I do agree with you that there are definetly some scrounging low life bassa's out there that are claiming benefits they are not entitled to claim and I hope the DWP catch them.

 

[jaffa]

Munkey!

Finally someone of sanity comes to my aide.

And benny. I am the pope, that's why!

No hunting in packs please...lol

You were doing fine on your own m8, you have put your opinion over and so have others. Its actually been a reasonably calm thread (thankfully).

 

[benny59]

Munkey!

Finally someone of sanity comes to my aide.

And benny. I am the pope, that's why!

hahaha, i was'nt sure at 1st m8, {either the pope, a social security officer or a copper}

 

[earthshayker]

I download stuff, and got a dreambox.

I've already stated this when RABP tried to do the moral equivalency thing.

It is not the same.

If it is, then anyone who does something illegal is not allowed to criticize any other illegality; a person who downloads an mp3 is not allowed to criticize a murderer. Do you see? When you apply reductionist logic to the matter it becomes absurd.

There are shades of grey in life. My shade is different to yours. You turn a blind eye to the countries resources being squandered on benefit cheats (yes I know the government are bad too etc etc). I do not.

Crap pure crap

Reasons for this thread is the fact that people claim when not entitled to do so: knock-on effect is other people who are entitled will more than likely miss out or find the application process too stressful (because of all the fraud) so again miss out.

Now you download stuff: knock-on effect is the poor sod who does not have the know how to download pays higher prices because the company YOU are defrauding will increase the cost of their goods to compensate for people like us who don't pay for it.

 

[Dazza]

Wow, this got interesting after I left yesterday..! lol

Still looks like envy to me.

As somebody said before, not all disabilities are obvious, so try and be positive as you can that there is a fiddle going on. - Don't just waste taxpayers money on a fraud investigation that was on whim/jealousy/no evidence/hearsay/etc...

Again, just because you, (JFish and his wife) paid 45k for his extention, doesn't mean everyone would. My uncle is a builder, he's do the work for me at cost, but obviously the time scale would be to suit his needs, it'd still cost a lot less than your 45k though...

It's also pefectly possibly to have got the money from a 3rd party to fund the extention. Or had a grant, or part grant/part self and/or external fund, cover the cost of the work.

People talk shit all the time, (look around ffs) just because your neighbour says "things" doesn't mean he did, or intends to do these things. I've got a cousin who talks the biggest pile of shit, but people fall for it, and believe what he says. Madness!

It's the blokes wife I'm worried for, if she's genuninely disabled, it's her you'll be hurting the most. She can't help it if her old man is gobby, big mouth twat...

Get your evidence, be sure as you can, then report him if you really must, but don't hide behind your PC screen, saying he's this, that, and the other, when you don't actually know anything of the sort...

Mozr, do you do the lottery mate...?

 

[Munkey]

Crap pure crap

Reasons for this thread is the fact that people claim when not entitled to do so: knock-on effect is other people who are entitled will more than likely miss out or find the application process too stressful (because of all the fraud) so again miss out.

Now you download stuff: knock-on effect is the poor sod who does not have the know how to download pays higher prices because the company YOU are defrauding will increase the cost of their goods to compensate for people like us who don't pay for it.

That's a bit harsh. Terminology like defrauding should be best left to cases where it is appropriate.

The poor sod does not pay higher prices because of alleged DVD fraud. The poor sod pays high prices because that is what the studio want to charge him. Prices are not artificially high because of the amount of DVD fraud that goes on, that is a silly suggestion.

I don't wish to go on any offensive against you but considering that you drive a 330 coupe and you have the local authority spend thousands insulating your house for free you should throw smaller stones or throw none at all. Benefits should be for people that absolutely need them to survive.

 

[mozr]

@ Munkey

Hear! Hear!

@ earthshayker

I will only reiterate myself again, and i can't be bothered. If you do not see any distinction that's up to you.

I havent got a blackboard with me to do any diagrams.

:EDIT: @ karym6. That is selling material mate, not downloading for personal use. Its different

TBH the scumbag benefit fraudsters are usually the blokes doing the selling in the first place.