Private schools or FREE education - What do you think?

[Munkey]

The best preparation for Grammar school entrance exams is private tuition.

We decided a different route, and it worked fortunately.

We sent her to Kumon which she loves to bits, for maths and English tuition.

We also did a lot of past exam papers, and verbal reasoning papers.

I could not stress more the verbal reasoning. It was a component of the entrance exam, and believe me comprehensive primary schools do not teach verbal reasoning skills explicitly.

Thanks for that link. I have heard some of the mothers talking about this but I never looked into it further as we already have a tutor for Maths whilst my wife does English and I do IQ. I think I'm still going to check them out. There is a centre not to far from me so I'll give the lady a call and she what she has to offer.

The verbal reasoning is a good point that you bring up. I think they refer to it as comprehension at our school. EDIT - I just checked it out and we haven't come across this terminology. I will most definitely check this out.

The current 'hot' subject is comprehension. I get my daughter to explain to me what she has read in her own words. I'm finding this useful to gauge her understanding of written English.

 

[Diddy]

As a teacher in a state school I just want to say this:
state schools are on the whole great places and do a fantastic job despite the constant criticism from the media. Standards are higher and improving, behaviour is good teachers are decent hardworking people. OF COURSE there are exceptions that isthe nature of being human, but the exception also applies to public schools.
I just wish that there was more acknowledgement of the good work that goes on in our schools

I actually "fell bad" about my previous post, not that what i said wasn't true....but i should deffo have added that there are many hard working, dedicated and caring teachers in both systems. I mainly think the current system and all its flaws is the fault of the government and not the teachers. Not even the kids either, they know no different, I would say the abolition of the belt/cane is probably 40%+ of the problem with todays public schools, but that's for another thread.....It took that last little bit of authority away, add to that the fact that the government/local councils seem hell bent on closing schools for special needs kids (yep they are expected to join mainstream and learn at the same pace as everyone else......in reality slowing down "learning" for everyone. I feel sorry for the kids and the teachers in general. Tis a thankless job for sure.

 

[Curious123]

I am sorry but I disagree with a lot of the people on here who blame the govermnment for ruining education. I remeber having history lessons where the teacher used to take a nap and asked us to amuse ourselves. It is thanks to this government that they forced all teachers to have a degree before they can teach, why shouldn't teachers have performance managment like the rest of us. It is thanks to blair that all under five year olds go to nursery or schools, it is thanks to blair that we have such things like the breakfast clubs and evening clubs so parent like us can finis at a normal time and pick up our kids. I remeber having paying through the nose so my kids start private nursery early so we could start at a regular time now people get vouchers and credits. Why shouldn't crap schools be threatened with closures if the headmaster is not up to the job than he should be sacked same as everywhere Ofsted is good. Not every teacher has to be a mr chips nothing wrong with going to work and acheving your objectives without feeling you have to have a calling.

Apologies for the rant and off topic post.

 

[DeadTech]

I think it all depends on the teachers, children and don't forget the parents. As Spiky stated there are some great state run schools out there. They will give your kids more than just an education (exams aren't everything), they will give them social skills and can be fun too. My neice when to one of Hackneys state schools and ended up at Oxford, got a 1:1, pHd and is now lecturing at Portsmouth Uni. One of her fellow students from private school, didn't know how to order a drink at the bar!
My kids go to state schools, 1 at primary and the other at secondary (or high school as they call them now) and at both schools, the teachers are excellent and have so much enthusiasm about teaching the kids.
My eldest is taking his Spanish GCSE 2 years early, so he can't be doing that bad.
All that said, I do think that public school prepares you more for the financial and business side of life and if thats what you want for your kids then that is probably your best bet. GL

 

[english]

Thanks for the opinion guys. I am surprised that aside from forum member english everyone on this board is advocating a private education.

the member english isn't strictly knocking a private education, he's merely saying it's elitist and a good education should be available to all.

 

[mozr]

A salient point curious. I agree in most part.

Using your performance based theorem, private schools almost always outperform comprehensive schools, which is why they are the best. If they do not perform people will not pay. Unlike the stagnant swamp that is the uncompetitive realm of the tax payer's dime.

 

[mozr]

the member english isn't strictly knocking a private education, he's merely saying it's elitist and a good education should be available to all.

I agree. Do you not believe in elitism?

I do not ask this in an arch sense. Seriously, are we really all equal? Discuss. (possibly another thread)

 

[english]

I agree. Do you not believe in elitism?

I do not ask this in an arch sense. Seriously, are we really all equal? Discuss. (possibly another thread)

let me tell u a story

my little un was put in for a grammer school test/scholarship, i have no idea how she did (they wont say) but she was refused a place. however! a child in their class got in who's father is guess what ... a doctor! mine is well on a par with the child that got in.

tell me that's not elitist .........

 

[DeadTech]

Seriously, are we really all equal? Discuss. (possibly another thread)

Mentally or financially?

 

[mozr]

let me tell u a story

my little un was put in for a grammer school test/scholarship, i have no idea how she did (they wont say) but she was refused a place. however! a child in their class got in who's father is guess what ... a doctor! mine is well on a par with the child that got in.

tell me that's not elitist .........

Sorry to hear that.

But it seems that you are rightly annoyed at the possibility of your child not being offered a place based upon class.

Surely the fact that you pursued the place in the first place explicitly states your wish for elitism (for your daughter anyway).

I do not mean to be rude, but there is the possibility that your daughter did not do well at test, whereas the Doctor's child did better?

 

[mozr]

Mentally or financially?

Both.

There are rich morons, and poor morons, and because we are not a truly meritocratic species (and never will be), the rich morons get it easier.

 

[english]

Surely the fact that you pursued the place in the first place explicitly states your wish for elitism (for your daughter anyway).

I do not mean to be rude, but there is the possibility that your daughter did not do well at test, whereas the Doctor's child did better?

hehe

1. no i wouldn't want my daughter to be 'elite', just do very well in her life and be happy with herself.

2. my daughter and the other one were two of the three in the year that got all 5's in sats m8, so i doubt he would have done substantially better than her. you must know full well that the other one got in based on their fathers status, it's quite obvious.

 

[topdog1965]

hehe

1. no i wouldn't want my daughter to be 'elite', just do very well in her life and be happy with herself.

2. my daughter and the other one were two of the three in the year that got all 5's in sats m8, so i doubt he would have done substantially better than her. you must know full well that the other one got in based on their fathers status, it's quite obvious.

Well if you believe that become a doctor, I don't I am sure other factors were taken into account

 

[english]

Well if you believe that become a doctor, I don't I am sure other factors were taken into account

i don't think so. pay for urs m8 see where it gets you

 

[mozr]

hehe

1. no i wouldn't want my daughter to be 'elite', just do very well in her life and be happy with herself.

Your wish for your child's happiness is commendable. But by hoping for a grammar school education, you are wishing for access to a rarefied scholastic area. That is elitist. It's ok, I promise. But it is what it is. If you comprehend the definition of elitism you will find the majority of it's explanation is the very basis of a Grammar school education.

2. my daughter and the other one were two of the three in the year that got all 5's in sats m8, so i doubt he would have done substantially better than her. you must know full well that the other one got in based on their fathers status, it's quite obvious.

Is it not possible that your daughter did not do as well at exam? Just because she did well at sats, does not secure consistency for every test. It does not have to be substantial, just slight.

I know as a parent you see the best in your child, and so you should. Your child is obviously bright, but it could easily be the fact that she was not prepared for the type of examination. As I have mentioned the 'verbal reasoning' test separated a lot of pupils at my daughter's new school.

I'm sure you're daughter will do well, with your obvious belief in her she can't go wrong.

 

[english]

the next person to say that my daughter failed because she's not up to the job will be hung by the bollocks on london bridge because it's not true. this is turning into the same old bullshit because someone (me) has spoken their mind on this subject and certain 'haters' don't like what i say. end of. good night and enjoy your lurking u loonies.

 

[digicol]

Never read all the posts mate so have no idea what has been posted after the first page.

Anyway whatever you choose for your children please remember that a private school will give them a more secluded life around their own town (depending on the size of it) as most children will go to a public school and will not know your own children first hand. This could mean social life being a little more difficult for them as they could be classed as outsiders.

Other than that, well, do you think the cash is worth it now or to be kept for a later date to give them a better start in life once they have decided what they want to do?

Either way please remember that your kids will eventually develop a personality of their own and a private school does not guarantee a nice clean social life, if you know what I mean. Or indeed a better future.

If your family is currently in a local social environment that gets on with the average people in your area then stick to a public free school. If your in a high class posh estate where most people keep themselves to themselves then a private school is well worth a thought.

I personally think it is all down to the area you live and it's surroundings.

 

[mozr]

I agree with Digicol.

A private education does not guarantee anything. It just makes the odds better. It is not the be all and end all.

And English, not once have I been hateful, nor stated that your daughter would not do well at private school. Level 5's at sats is extraordinary and you should be proud (although she must not be in year six as the results are not out yet AFAIK).

I know you are annoyed, but without knowing all the test results, you cannot make an informed decision on whether your child lost out on merit, or the social status of parents. I am annoyed myself at the lack of transparency regarding the exams.

She just may not have done as well at test in that particular instance. Is that possible?

Again, I wish you and your daughter well (and also feel sorry for any doctor you encounter for the next ten years, ).

 

[Munkey]

the member english isn't strictly knocking a private education, he's merely saying it's elitist and a good education should be available to all.

A good education should be available for all but that is romanticising how things should be but are far from. We'll never have a equal education in this country as our fundamantal morals do not allow for this.

I'm not ashamed to say that I'm striving for elitism if that is what you guys want to call it. I do want my children to be a class above me. I want them to have better opportunities, experience much more at a young age and generally be away from the riff raff. Grammar school places are very limited and I sure as hell don't want to chance my kid not getting in and ending up in a crap local comprehensive.

----

Here's a worrying trend I have noticed in the London area.

All Roman Catholic Schools are full of black and white kids. (asians not allowed even if they live on the doorstep of the school. The schools are state schools!)
Grammar schools are mainly asian and white with some black kids.
Comprehensive schools are either all black or all asian depending on the area.
Private schools are an equal blend of all races or lean towards a majority white.

If I decide to go the free education route the chances are my kid will end up in a all asian school - WTF. Why are all free schools mainly filled with black and asian children? State sponsored racism? I think the schooling system is racist with the ethnic minorities being dumped in some of the worst state schools. I sure as hell don't want my local authority to tell me what crap schools my kid have to go to. I want freedom of choice and a private education gives me this.

Is the education system completely screwed up or what in London or is this reflective across the UK?

 

[topdog1965]

the next person to say that my daughter failed because she's not up to the job will be hung by the bollocks on london bridge because it's not true. this is turning into the same old bullshit because someone (me) has spoken their mind on this subject and certain 'haters' don't like what i say. end of. good night and enjoy your lurking u loonies.

PMSL are having a tantrum now :arrrr: