Biometric Passports

[FUBAR69]

Karym6, there are several reasons for a Bio Passport being better than credit card transactions, flight ticket booking and mobile phone tracking.

Simply speaking the above require a court order or at the very least a prima facia case in order to access.

They also need to know your credit card details and phone number and phone provider, granted if you are and international terrorist then some of our more clandestine services would have this info at their fingertips, but for Joe public it is actually quite surprising how long it can take.

Plus, if I was a international bad boy 1, I would not be making any electronic transactions (credit cards) 2, I would not be using a phone registered to me, using at least 3 pay as ya go sims per week. 3, I would never make travel arrangements in advance, simply turn up and pay cash

Plus if they have a wanted man that would like to vacate the country kinda sharpish then a passport is kinda required.

Thats why.

 

[karym6]

Karym6, there are several reasons for a Bio Passport being better than credit card transactions, flight ticket booking and mobile phone tracking.

Simply speaking the above require a court order or at the very least a prima facia case in order to access.

They also need to know your credit card details and phone number and phone provider, granted if you are and international terrorist then some of our more clandestine services would have this info at their fingertips, but for Joe public it is actually quite surprising how long it can take.

Plus, if I was a international bad boy 1, I would not be making any electronic transactions (credit cards) 2, I would not be using a phone registered to me, using at least 3 pay as ya go sims per week. 3, I would never make travel arrangements in advance, simply turn up and pay cash

Plus if they have a wanted man that would like to vacate the country kinda sharpish then a passport is kinda required.

Thats why.

but by that same rationale, if te whole populace of innocent people were to b tracked by this shadowy secret government body,then the people standing out would be the naughty people - so again I guess it works both ways.

Whilst a court order is required to get access to this info, I doubt that one would be used should anyone actually want to track people via the passport. For instance, the US government didnt seek permission from its courts to track Pablo Escobar in a different country via his mobile, nor did they seek permission from Escobars government to do this.

As I said before, I sincerely doubt that the government actually cares where 99% of the people in the UK actually go when they leave, instead they will probably be more interested in that one percent - the group that stand out from the crowd. If biometric ID makes them stand out more then who is to say that this isnt a benefit?

And the point on electronic transactions, some would need to be made at least. Most countries dont allow you to bring in large amounts of paper currency when you land/get off the boat. So, in the case of a criminal, a transfer of funds would need to be made. Once that is done it wouldnt be so hard to track that persons movement -after all thats what the security services do now.

But of course, this idea works on the fact the government doesnt really want to know what planes we are getting on.

 

[FUBAR69]

So I take it from your first point that is ok to trample on the rights of everybody in order to show up some of the more dodgy ones ?

Explain that one again Karym6?

And for having to use electronic transactions, most terrorists are network supported and do no require large sums of cash on them, indeed they would not want to in case it drew attention to them.

We have an misconception that our Intel services are really switched on, well let me tell you they aint and often work for the greater good (a benchmark set by themselves) or even more of a laugh they hide behind "public interest"

Do do really think they can stop international terrorism when "Paddy" can mix up half a ton of home made explosives(under some of the most intense military & Intel surveillance of the day I may add) throw it in the back of a van and take a nice drive from Armagh to the financial heart of London itself !! and "our" guys don't even know he is there !!

And this by far is not the only example, so don't see why I have to have my rights trampled on simply because these ars*holes can't do their job.

 

[K]

Im not against the new passport as such.. but i am against the fact that they have taken the queen off it... it seems our goverment is slowly stripping our identity.

 

[FUBAR69]

maybe there is a biometric picture of her in the chip :roflmao:

 

[karym6]

The biometric doest trample on our rights, it makes it harder for pasports to be copied.

If your idea about the government using it to track the populace was indeed true, then there may be cause for paranioa - but it isnt.

I also think your comments on domestic terrorism are misplaced on this thread.

I find it strange that you feel we are losing our identity as a country, when your signature would suggest otherwise.

So I take it from your first point that is ok to trample on the rights of everybody in order to show up some of the more dodgy ones ?

Explain that one again Karym6?

And for having to use electronic transactions, most terrorists are network supported and do no require large sums of cash on them, indeed they would not want to in case it drew attention to them.

We have an misconception that our Intel services are really switched on, well let me tell you they aint and often work for the greater good (a benchmark set by themselves) or even more of a laugh they hide behind "public interest"

Do do really think they can stop international terrorism when "Paddy" can mix up half a ton of home made explosives(under some of the most intense military & Intel surveillance of the day I may add) throw it in the back of a van and take a nice drive from Armagh to the financial heart of London itself !! and "our" guys don't even know he is there !!

And this by far is not the only example, so don't see why I have to have my rights trampled on simply because these ars*holes can't do their job.

 

[dave24]

Gordon Brown has actually told you this has he? No i didn`t think so,so how can you say this,your just like the rest of us you don`t know one way or the other.

If your idea about the government using it to track the populace was indeed true, then there may be cause for paranioa - but it isnt.

 

[karym6]

Gordon Brown has actually told you this has he? No i didn`t think so,so how can you say this,your just like the rest of us you don`t know one way or the other.

Dave, if you thought about it carefully then you would realise its just a silly paranoid idea.

As others have pointed out, you only use the passport sparingly through the year (most of us anyway - I dont have more than one holiday a year) and this is when you leave or enter the UK - this is the only place where the populce could be tracked. So, if for some bizarre reason the government did start doing this, they would know about everyone who arrived through immigration as well as everyone who leaves the country along with their destination.

When you actually get past the paranioa and think about it sensibly - why would that info be important to the government?

 

[dave24]

What comes after the passport though,you really don`t see the bigger picture do you?

Dave, if you thought about it carefully then you would realise its just a silly paranoid idea.

As others have pointed out, you only use the passport sparingly through the year (most of us anyway - I dont have more than one holiday a year) and this is when you leave or enter the UK - this is the only place where the populce could be tracked. So, if for some bizarre reason the government did start doing this, they would know about everyone who arrived through immigration as well as everyone who leaves the country along with their destination.

When you actually get past the paranioa and think about it sensibly - why would that info be important to the government?

 

[karym6]

Dave, after this passport, we get a new type of passport - and we will continue to keep getting new ones.

If you are alluding to an ID card, so what? We don have one now, and the scheme itself doesnt look like it will ever come to fruition.

No, I gather you know that many european countries already have ID cards, and have for some time? Plces like France, Germany, Greece & Italy. You will notice that the government isnt subversively controlling the populace there?

But then again, your last post didnt try and answer my question, did it?

However, even though this is about the passprt, I suggest you go read up on the ID card as well as the problems it is facing right now.

 

[dave24]

like i said you don`t get the bigger picture,it`s all about control,the authorities want be happy until they have this,it`s just a shame people like you can`t see this, until it`s too late.

Dave, after this passport, we get a new type of passport - and we will continue to keep getting new ones.

If you are alluding to an ID card, so what? We don have one now, and the scheme itself doesnt look like it will ever come to fruition.

No, I gather you know that many european countries already have ID cards, and have for some time? Plces like France, Germany, Greece & Italy. You will notice that the government isnt subversively controlling the populace there?

But then again, your last post didnt try and answer my question, did it?

However, even though this is about the passprt, I suggest you go read up on the ID card as well as the problems it is facing right now.

 

[karym6]

like i said you don`t get the bigger picture,it`s all about control,the authorities want be happy until they have this,it`s just a shame people like you can`t see this, until it`s too late.

when you say "people like you", what exactly do you mean?

You seem to think I should believe your idea that this is all for control of the populace and that I shouldnt think this is purely a passport, without actually citing any evidence that proves your right and the government wrong.

You also seem unable to provide sensible answers to any of the questions raised on this thread.

 

[dave24]

their not sensible answers to you,because their not the answers you want too hear,like anyone who disagrees with your way of thinking,I believe what i want to believe same as you,i`am not trying to say you should believe what i`am saying,what made you think that or is this just one of your little games you like to play.

when you say "people like you", what exactly do you mean?

You seem to think I should believe your idea that this is all for control of the populace and that I shouldnt think this is purely a passport, without actually citing any evidence that proves your right and the government wrong.

You also seem unable to provide sensible answers to any of the questions raised on this thread.

 

[karym6]

their not sensible answers to you,because their not the answers you want too hear,like anyone who disagrees with your way of thinking,I believe what i want to believe same as you,i`am not trying to say you should believe what i`am saying,what made you think that or is this just one of your little games you like to play.

no, this isnt a little game.

When I say sensible answers, I was speaking in general terms - you havent even tried to answer any of the questions posed here.

You havent even been able to tell me why I should follow your point of view.

Thats me out of this thread until fubar posts back. At least he/she contributes something.

 

[dave24]

Goodbye,shut the door on your way out:CRYBABY:

no, this isnt a little game.

When I say sensible answers, I was speaking in general terms - you havent even tried to answer any of the questions posed here.

You havent even been able to tell me why I should follow your point of view.

Thats me out of this thread until fubar posts back. At least he/she contributes something.

 

[maarksparky]

phew !! easy guys...

I've got one solution, dont get the passport made if you dont like it...

 

[oxkiller]

It’s all about money seen how much passports have gone up so every time they bring out new passport what’s no better than the last it go's up put a use less chip on it go's up

 

[maarksparky]

I know the cost has gone up and its ridiculous that it costs 75 but we are only following The International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO - which sets international standards). The facial recognition as the primary biometric with iris and fingerprint as backup.

Biometric information makes our life easier:

• to allow automated immigration checks in the future
• to ensure that British citizens can continue to benefit from visa-free travel to the USA

:Smileysex

 

[Donnie Darko]

phew !! easy guys...

I've got one solution, dont get the passport made if you dont like it...

Seems the obvious solution.

 

[Munkey]

no, this isnt a little game.

When I say sensible answers, I was speaking in general terms - you havent even tried to answer any of the questions posed here.

You havent even been able to tell me why I should follow your point of view.

Thats me out of this thread until fubar posts back. At least he/she contributes something.

You have never answered any of my questions when I have put them to you, but rather answered in silly one or two worded sentances. I notice that you fill a lot of page space with a lot of nothing. I'm not surprised that more forum members on haven't picked up on it. I am referring to an earlier thread though but the point remains.

Take your own advice, you might learn something. (No need to google any of this, I'd recommend using your our brain to think objectively)