Gunman kills several in west Cumbria

[v14]

Are you advocating tougher gun legislation?

Well the old "guns dont kill people" argument is rather specious.

Michael Ryan, Thomas Hamilton and now Derek Bird, all licensed gun owners.
Had they not had access to firearms would they have used a machete or whatever?
Personally i think probably not. We'll never know now but i think i'd take my chances with a guy wielding a machete over one with a gun pointed at my coconut anyday.

 

[Thommo]

Well the old "guns dont kill people" argument is rather specious.

Michael Ryan, Thomas Hamilton and now Derek Bird, all licensed gun owners.
Had they not had access to firearms would they have used a machete or whatever?
Personally i think probably not. We'll never know now but i think i'd take my chances with a guy wielding a machete over one with a gun pointed at my coconut anyday.

still dont think its to do with the licensing tho, imagine we had no licensing laws, question, would these 3 men still have comitted the same crime, answer probably yes.

the fact licensing is one of the toughest worldwide has probably stopped more of these crimes. theres no way to stop this happening.

i see where your coming from i do but there is also the flip side to look at, i dont see that they where licensed had anything to do with it.

there isnt anything stopping anyone getting hold of illegal firearms and doing this.

to date its not happened but its not to say it cant and wont happen.

i too would rather look at a machete over a gun pointed at me but i could also say i would prefer to be the one pointing my gun at them if they pointed anything axe, gun, knife ect... at me.

we're all different and all will have different takes on it, if we where all the same then this crime wouldnt have happened would it.

still a shame though, thankfully we are able to discuss this, others unfortunatley dont have that pleasure.

 

[tornadojay]

well guns r made for killing my brv came out the army i came home one nite and his sat there with what u would call his personal gun they make them out of spare parts his wife had run off why he was away so i new what he wanted to do i did get it off him but he now does have guns says for hunting he is mad and i would be the first to say it and he has them the legal way now the licence is to easy to get should be harder but in saying that more people die here from knifes.

 

[v14]

still dont think its to do with the licensing tho, imagine we had no licensing laws, question, would these 3 men still have comitted the same crime, answer probably yes.

the fact licensing is one of the toughest worldwide has probably stopped more of these crimes. theres no way to stop this happening.

i see where your coming from i do but there is also the flip side to look at, i dont see that they where licensed had anything to do with it.

there isnt anything stopping anyone getting hold of illegal firearms and doing this.

to date its not happened but its not to say it cant and wont happen.

i too would rather look at a machete over a gun pointed at me but i could also say i would prefer to be the one pointing my gun at them if they pointed anything axe, gun, knife ect... at me.

we're all different and all will have different takes on it, if we where all the same then this crime wouldnt have happened would it.

still a shame though, thankfully we are able to discuss this, others unfortunatley dont have that pleasure.

How about this then.

We ban joe public from keeping guns altogether.
Unless you can absolutely prove 100% you couldn't do your job without one you can't have a license.

Recreational shooting could be accommodated by licensing the locations (ie gun clubs, estates where game shooting is held etc) with the provision that all firearms are stored securely at the actual licensed location.

Thereafter anyone found with a gun in their possession gets an automatic 10yrs. No lawyers no trial, no excuses. Straight to jail do not pass go.

 

[thebigyin]

How about this then.

We ban joe public from keeping guns altogether.
Unless you can absolutely prove 100% you couldn't do your job without one you can't have a license.

QUOTE]thebigyin)i agree with that mate as the gun laws are getting abused and no one knows who is capital of using a gun in the wrong way until it happens then its too late

 

[IANB]

Guns should be electroncaly tagged and the police informed when they will be used and for which purpose. Police then give permission to use. Outside this the tag would flag up unauthorised use and action then taken.
Expensive to set up i hear you say. Well yes but make the gun license holders pay the fees to cover it.

 

[phawk754]

This is a tragic event which should never have happened, my sympathies are with the families who have lost loved ones and family members

I have the same type of guns that were used in this tragic event and one which is more powerful ,I have been shooting on an off for the past 20 years


Why is it when something like this happens the first thing that gets said is ban guns , guns do not kill people, people kill people

I have to renew my gun license every five years, I have to find two non family members to sign to say I am fit to own a gun and one of them people has to be within a professional position ie , manager, Dr,etc

Then I have to find a land owner who will give written consent for me to shoot on his land

Then I have the firearms officer come out and check my cabinet and than have a chat with me to make sure I am fit to own a gun and I know what i am doing with it, firearms officer has the right to contact my doctor and to do background checks on me

If I break any laws , fighting, speeding,etc I have to report all this to my firearms officer who will then make the decision whether I keep my firearms license or not


Going by some logic on gun laws should we not ban cars, knives, baseball bats,etc as there all can be used to kill someone if not used in the right way ?


I go out hunting and go clay shooting and have a great day out ,i have met hundreds of people and made great friends through shooting


I have a sad feeling in the bottom of my stomach that idiots who do not understand the sport will gradually make it impossible for law-abiding people to own guns, I wonder how many more hoops i am going to have to jump through after this tragic event to keep my license

 

[Thommo]

cash flow put an end to my shooting but i still have the love for it, its the same old arguement those that dont do it dont understand and when something shit happens its not the man blamed its the gun.

same with dogs, staffies devil dogs ect.... ban em bullshit, those who dont know or own will never understand and as in this case blame the easy target.. the gun or in the dogs case the breed.

 

[nara]

....same with dogs, staffies devil dogs ect.... ban em bullshit, those who dont know or own will never understand and as in this case blame the easy target.. the gun or in the dogs case the breed.

Guns are inanimate objects. They can't do anything on their own. Dogs can.

The analogy doesn't work.

 

[Thommo]

Guns are inanimate objects. They can't do anything on their own.Dogs can.

The analogy doesn't work.

in your world where your always right maybe, but believe it or not most take your posts with a pinch of salt, we dont believe everything you type is gospel.

so anyway,it does in the way im using it, both cases the wrong thing is being blamed. i didnt say dogs in general either i said breeds are blamed. not dogs as you use it.

oh and people havent been killed by a misfiring gun? please dont say that misfires are a direct cause of the user as that proves my point about blame.



,

 

[Raven24]

Guns are inanimate objects. They can't do anything on their own. Dogs can.

The analogy doesn't work.

I think the point is that both guns and dogs are an extension of the owners....both can do damage if willed so. But in the hands of sensible good willed people they are comforting and protective. So yes the analogy does work, especially when silly sods can blow their bollocks off when sitting down if they aren't careful.

 

[v14]

cash flow put an end to my shooting but i still have the love for it, its the same old arguement those that dont do it dont understand and when something shit happens its not the man blamed its the gun.

the gun just makes it easy. It gives weak minded psycho screwballs a massive advantage when they tip over the edge.

it allows them to kill from distance.

guns don't kill people, arseholes who own guns do.

 

[Rodbouy]

I dont think guns should be allowed to be kept at home at all. They should be kept at a storage facility at the local police dept and only allowed to be released for a period of time in a 12hr period of day and must be returned within that given time. You should also have to book the removal of the gun for the period well in advance of you wishing to use it.

Just a thought

 

[Thommo]

the gun just makes it easy. It gives weak minded psycho screwballs a massive advantage when they tip over the edge.

it allows them to kill from distance.

guns don't kill people, arseholes who own guns do.

agreed arseholes with guns, but how do we tell? you cant take them away from everyone who legally owns them to suit what some people want, the case still remains the legal gun owner is being picked on in this thread yet ive not seen one mention of the illegal firearms which are own by arseholes. (note i dont own one but you can call me an arsehole if you choose lol)

this is the country we live in and laws are not passed to suit everyone, would davidh be happy if someone went on a rampage with a bow and arrow and wanted to take his away?, no and good gun owner are not happy about this event.

same with something you love, i know its not in the same league but it does prove a point to an extent, would you give your car up or be happy about it because there was too many drunks on the road?

nope you wouldnt and in that case you would blame the drunks for your car being taken.

i know its hard for some people who dont shoot to understand why its wrong to target them when its the man who is to blame not everyone else who happens to share the same hobby.

we wont agree nobody ever does on these subjects and it turns into whos on whos side, no body can force or change your mind but its the same for the people who dont agree.

would gun crime stop if the legally owned gun where taken? simpleanswer is no, so then who do you blame?

last post now as i see the masses gathering in there huddle and theres only one outcome, the few on here vs the many.

i respect people views on the subject but i dont have to agree with it like others dont agree with me.

.

 

[v14]

My right to not be shot in the street by an arsehole overrides anyone else's right to own a gun as far as i'm concerned.

As for implementation see post 24. That would work for me.

 

[Thommo]

My right to not be shot in the street overrides anyone else's right to own a gun as far as i'm concerned.

As for implementation see post 24. That would work for me.

said i wouldnt post damn, last one i promise as the thanks brigade has started.

i here what your saying and i respect your feeling of needing/wanting to feel safer, but heres what im saying, this thread is aimed at the legal owner of a gun, would you still not be at risk of the illegal firearms that have been neglected in this thread?

would punishing the legal owner make you actually feel safer? because in reality you probably have more chance of being shot by an illegal firearm.

anyway deff last post, its taking away from the actual thread which is a shame,

ps i'll go check post 24.

 

[witchy]

said i wouldnt post damn, last one i promise as the thanks brigade has started.

I must be the Thanks Brigade

 

[v14]

said i wouldnt post damn, last one i promise as the thanks brigade has started.

i here what your saying and i respect your feeling of needing/wanting to feel safer, but heres what im saying, this thread is aimed at the legal owner of a gun, would you still not be at risk of the illegal firearms that have been neglected in this thread?

would punishing the legal owner make you actually feel safer? because in reality you probably have more chance of being shot by an illegal firearm.

anyway deff last post, its taking away from the actual thread which is a shame,

ps i'll go check post 24.

m8 i think i covered illegal ownership in post 24?

no license...gun illegal... jail?

 

[Messa]

Are you advocating tougher gun legislation?

No, that machetes should be easier to get hold of.

I think

 

[phawk754]

My right to not be shot in the street by an arsehole overrides anyone else's right to own a gun as far as i'm concerned.

As for implementation see post 24. That would work for me.

so you are saying that your right not to be shot would take away the right of anyone to own a gun ,

so my right not to be hit by a arsehole who can not drive a car ,would then ban anyone from having a car

would my right not to get into to a fight with a noob in town at the weekend as he has had to much to drink give me the right to ban anyone from having a drink ?

you can make the rest up as i am sure there are lots more i could come up with