I started a petetion fo equal state pensions if anyone would like to read it and sign if they agree with it.
Thanks Sandra
Signez la pétition
Thanks Sandra
Signez la pétition
Equal state pensions
- Thread starter Sandra51
- Start date
The new state pension has a higher qualification criteria so it's quite possible that some pensioners on the old scheme could lose out. Probably a lot of women especially who only worked part time while they brought up their families. Under the old pension rules you should have been able to qualify for an additional pension through SERPS.
I was in the SERPS scheme but my extra contributions are no longer valid. I contracted out for a short while but still managed my 35 qualifying years needed for the new state pension despite also having a number of years self employed. The old scheme was only 30 years of full national insurance contributions.
There is now also a minimum 10 year record of contributions needed to qualify for any pension at all. I reach my pension age of 66 in February so have already "lost" 12 months of pension. Others will have to go to 67 before being able to receive a pension.
As you can see it's not exactly a level playing field so it would not be easy or perhaps even fair to make them equal. With the 10 year minimum NIC period I would imagine there may be as many losers as winners.
I don't think it's particularly fair to have this difference but I don't know how it could be fixed.
I was in the SERPS scheme but my extra contributions are no longer valid. I contracted out for a short while but still managed my 35 qualifying years needed for the new state pension despite also having a number of years self employed. The old scheme was only 30 years of full national insurance contributions.
There is now also a minimum 10 year record of contributions needed to qualify for any pension at all. I reach my pension age of 66 in February so have already "lost" 12 months of pension. Others will have to go to 67 before being able to receive a pension.
As you can see it's not exactly a level playing field so it would not be easy or perhaps even fair to make them equal. With the 10 year minimum NIC period I would imagine there may be as many losers as winners.
I don't think it's particularly fair to have this difference but I don't know how it could be fixed.
Everyone paid in what the government set the rules for people to pay in at the time.
I paid in as an employee, as self employed, as an employer, as the MD of a limited company, including class 4 contributions while self employed in addition to the class 2 contributions and it seems that all the graduated national insurance that I paid while I was an employee for some 14 years were discounted when the system changed some years later while I was self employed, maybe it was when SERPS came in as I was self employed by that time.
A simpler thing would have been to just give a pro rata amount of whatever the new pension was for everyone for the qualifyng years that they contributed as I worked from the age of 16 until I retired at 60 years and 11 months so whichever way you look at it I contributed for more than the minimum qualifying of both the older and the newer pensions and even though I may have paid in fewer pounds than those who retired later than me, those fewer pounds were worth more than the later pounds are, as I was contributing from the days that a gallon of petrol was 6s 8d and a pint of beer was 1s 10d
I paid in as an employee, as self employed, as an employer, as the MD of a limited company, including class 4 contributions while self employed in addition to the class 2 contributions and it seems that all the graduated national insurance that I paid while I was an employee for some 14 years were discounted when the system changed some years later while I was self employed, maybe it was when SERPS came in as I was self employed by that time.
A simpler thing would have been to just give a pro rata amount of whatever the new pension was for everyone for the qualifyng years that they contributed as I worked from the age of 16 until I retired at 60 years and 11 months so whichever way you look at it I contributed for more than the minimum qualifying of both the older and the newer pensions and even though I may have paid in fewer pounds than those who retired later than me, those fewer pounds were worth more than the later pounds are, as I was contributing from the days that a gallon of petrol was 6s 8d and a pint of beer was 1s 10d
We always had the option to buy N.I stamps to bridge the gap to Class 1. Admittedly I never did and had 12 years which didn't count on my contribution record. The keyword here is "contributions". If you haven't paid enough contributions then how can you justify fighting for the same pension?
Your argument that your contributions were worth more because of the price you paid for petrol and beer is a novel one but doesn't quite cut the mustard.
If you qualified through your contributions but got less pension I would agree with you wholeheartedly.
Your argument that your contributions were worth more because of the price you paid for petrol and beer is a novel one but doesn't quite cut the mustard.
If you qualified through your contributions but got less pension I would agree with you wholeheartedly.
I did more years than required for both versions of the pension but I still only get paid the lower rated one and not the higher one, even though I had more than the 35 years necessary for a full pension on the higher rate.
were you paying NI for all the years?
Either paying or credited for them for a few weeks when I was unemployed after being made redundant, before going self employed and a few weeks on the sick but it wouldn't matter if I had neveer had a day off sick or unemployed as I would still get £42 a week less than if I had retired after April 2016 instead of before it.
This petition is highly misleading. Before saying why, I need to explain that the system before April 2016 had two elements:
1. The "basic" state pension, which required 35 years' contributions to earn the full amount (currently £139.60).
2. The State Second Pension (formerly SERPS) which was earned only by employed people (not the self-employed). Broadly speaking, the more an employed person earned, the more National Insurance Contributions (NIC) they paid and the more pension they earned (up to a limit). Anyone who had been contributing for most of their working lives would have earned a total pension (basic plus second pension) considerably more than the new flat rate of £179.60. We are currently in a transitional period where that higher entitlement is protected and anyone retiring now will get that instead of the £179.60.
The petition is misleading because people who retired before April 2016 would generally be on only the basic pension of £139.60 a week for one of two reasons, neither of which is the result of any unfairness in the system:
1. They were employed and contracted out of the State Second Pension (formerly SERPS). In those cases, part of their National Insurance Contributions (NIC) was transferred to their company or private pension scheme, which is now required to make up the difference. They are therefore getting more than £139.60, but the extra is coming from the pension scheme rather than the state.
2. They were self-employed for most of their lives, in which case they earned only the basic pension, not any second pension. That lower entitlement was reflected in the lower rate of NIC which they paid, so they should have been aware of that and made some separate private pension provision. If they did not do that, there is no justification for complaining now.
I would also say, though, that the National Insurance records held by HMRC are a bit of a mess. I recently reached pension age and my record shows that I have 50 years' contributions, which is impossible as my working life covered only 48 tax years and the first and last would not count, as they were part years. Those extra credits don't earn me any extra pension, though, as 35 years' contributions earn as much as it is possible to get.
I would advise everyone to check their own contribution record and ask for a pension forecast, in case any of your past contributions have not been credited to you. That is why you should always keep your P60s to prove what you have paid, in case you have not been properly credited.
Similar threads
