this is stupid. taken from another forum...

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copied and pasted............

Im new here but I have been browsing the site for a while. Unfortunately this is my first post, and Im after some help.

This is copied and pasted form another forum:-

5th May-

For “Having my feet on the seats” of a train! I’d just finished a uni exam and sat down in an almost empty carriage with 4 seats to myself. 2 on my side facing backwards and 2 opposite facing me. I was on the phone to a mate at the time talking about revision I was going to do for the exam the following morning. So I was sat against the wall with my left foot on the panel between the opposite seat and wall, with my uni file resting on my knee, my phone in my left hand and my right turning the pages.

A few minutes later a guy in uniform came through the carriage and asked me to take me feet off the seats. As I was on the phone I just said “yeah sure” and carried on talking to my mate, now unable to hold my file in just one hand. At first I didn’t realise he was a policeman. I thought he was just train security. He then asked me if I’d heard the announcement. I said “no I didn’t I was on the phone as I boarded”. He then started asking me questions about who I was, where I was going, checked my ticket, etc… and then told me he wanted a word when I got off at the next station.

I didn’t think much of it but then noticed he was writing a report down in his note pad. We got off the train and he said he’d have to take me into one of the offices. He then said he wasn't going to arrest me!!! But had to caution me and said the usual- “Anything you say may be used as evidence, etc….” I almost burst out laughing, I couldn’t believe he was serious. He then asked me for a statement, “for the record” and asked me why I had my feet on the seats. I said “I didn’t, my foot was on the panel along side the seat, so I could hold my file while looking through my revision notes”. He was wearing head gear with a little camera. So I told him he could check the camera if he wanted.

He took my details and said they’d be sent to head office and that they may wish to take the matter further! WTF!!!!

Fortunately I was in a good mood, but I had to bite my lip several times.

To the bobbies on the forum- WTF was he doing?

I couldn’t understand why he was wasting my time and his. Surely he’s got something better to do? Its not as if Im a little chav intimidating grannies, and it was blatantly obvious I was looking through my uni file. I couldn’t think of a better reason to have my foot on the SIDE PANEL!

He said I’ll receive a letter in the post. If I do I will be writing a letter of complaint back.

Sean

.................................................. .................................................. ...........................

6th June-

*UPDATE

I can't Fecking believe it! I've just received a court summons!

The letter says I have to appear at Liverpool Magistrates Court on the 20th of August. If I am convicted, the court will be asked to order me to pay costs. If I plead guilty I will only have to pay costs in the sum of £150!

So if I decide to contest it and I lose, I'll have to pay significantly more.

I can't believe this, I thought I was going to receive a letter saying I'd been a naughty boy, if anything at all. Not a bl**dy court summons.

The letter also says, if I believe I didn't behave in a disorderly, indecent or offensive manner and I want to call upon the witness and any other evidence, I have to do so within 7 days.

My parents are away on holiday at the moment and my bro who's doing Law at uni is also away on holiday.

So has anyone got some advice for me?

My bobby mate says he'll come to court with me if I want.
.................................................................................................................................

Im currently trying to get this resolved out of court. I've contacted someone in a senior position who is looking at my case.
.................................................................................................................................

I've just found out that this is definitely a Criminal Case not Civil, and if I lose I will have a Criminal Record!

This is ridiculous!

Are there any solicitors on the forum?

Any help most appreciated.
Click to expand...
 
you do get that kind of idiot of a policeman occasionally going about, probably just "meeting targets" etc.

ridiculous nonetheless
 
Thats just crazy that ,It would be a horrible situation to be in though.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
he said in his 5th May notes:
To the bobbies on the forum- WTF was he doing?

then in his 6th May notes he said:
My bobby mate says he'll come to court with me if I want.

why didn't he ask his mate in the 1st place LOL
 
it would be quite hard to get a conviction for having his feet up on the seats - it definitely wouldnt be a criminal case as this "crime" took place on the train, so comes under british tranport police's remit.

There are crimes that can be taken to court whilst using public transport, such as wilfull damage and drinking alcohol. However, I dont see how this could be tried in a criminal court at all. Liverpool has some pretty out there laws, but this would be a magistrates court case first.

Im no lawyer, but my gf has been studying law now for quite a while and is about to qualify as a lawyer in England (she is qualified in Scotland already)
 
This does sound like its gone a bit too far , but we have stickers on our train windows telling people to keep their feet of the seats , so maybe it is some railway bylaw and bt police can do him for it !!
 
timekeeper said:
This does sound like its gone a bit too far , but we have stickers on our train windows telling people to keep their feet of the seats , so maybe it is some railway bylaw and bt police can do him for it !!
Click to expand...

exactly, would never be a criminal case though.

In fact, I just checked the BTP website (very bored at work) and read the NW BTP policing plan, it includes Liverpool. Cases like this would be considered low level disorder and only get a judicial disposal if it ever get up in front of the magistrate. This is sort of like a caution, where if you break it you go straight back into court for the full whack. They are reviewed after 12 months.

Methinks this may be someone telling tall tales...
 
Why do I get the feeling that isn't true and it's the guy making up a story to get a rise out of the forum?

He says:
He then said he wasn't going to arrest me!!! But had to caution me and said the usual- “Anything you say may be used as evidence, etc….”
Click to expand...

Aren't miranda rights usually only given when you're arrested?
 
Kris said:
Why do I get the feeling that isn't true and it's the guy making up a story to get a rise out of the forum?

He says:


Aren't miranda rights usually only given when you're arrested?
Click to expand...

also, cautions need to be done with a witness present and are not done on the spot.

I have been cautioned twice in different places and they were the same.

I have seen a few random posts on other forums like this recently, it seems to be a bit subversive at times.
 
hmmmmm deff tail's he is making it up if it is true that's just plan crazy and will be chucked out of court but even so what i have just seen in his post he is telling tail's i think :)
 
this happened to my m8 many years ago infact 34 yrs ago in belgium
lol
he got an on the spot fine
something like 300 belgium franks i think it was
we sh*t our selves untill we done an exchange on money worked out about £2 lol
but it can happen
 
Attention seeker, musn't have many real life m8's.

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
 
police cant do anything but caution (and ask you to move along) when they have no witnesses (or fellow police officers). i was "seen" on my phone in my car once (was actually just scratching my head) and the police woman pulled me over (she was on her own), she said she was gonna have to fine me until i questioned her for witnesses to her allegation. (i also cheekily asked her how she "radio'd it in" without using her hands lol). so she said to be more careful, move along, blah blah blah, etc.

lack of witnesses/evidence in one way helps you get out of stupid police arguments in another its what gets criminals out of jail.
 
serioulsy fucked up

given a caution by security staff ends up with a criminal charge? How does that work? I didnt think security guards had any executive powers what so ever.

I think I take it all back about this guy, trust him to go do this in an area where they are coming down hard on hardend criminals like this...
 
a citizens arrest and executive powers are slightly different.

whilst anyone can perform a citizens arrest, there are a lot of things that would make such an action fall apart in court based on the citizen performing the arrest not understanding the law correctly.

in this instance, it is very short sighted of the Liverpudlian council to allow a security gaurd to arrest someone in a case that will be going to a criminal hearing....

99% of the time in the UK you will need a warrant to enact an arrest on regular people.

A citizens arrest in the UK can only stand up in court should the person trying to arrest know, without a doubt, that an offence has been commited. I think there is some other guff to go along with it, but you get the point.

I wonder if there were a lot of posters up explaining this new initiative to the communters? I have had an ignorant ticket inspector tell me the same thing when I am on the train home from work, they are normally quite rude about it.
 
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