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Goverment Database for all phone calls and email

DiamondGeezer

VIP Member
VIP Member
Ministers are to consider plans for a database of electronic information holding details of every phone call and e-mail sent in the UK, it has emerged.

The plans, reported in the Times, are at an early stage and may be included in the draft Communications Bill later this year, the Home Office confirmed.

A Home Office spokesman said the data was a "crucial tool" for protecting national security and preventing crime.

Ministers have not seen the plans which were drawn up by Home Office officials.

A Home Office spokesman said: "The Communications Data Bill will help ensure that crucial capabilities in the use of communications data for counter-terrorism and investigation of crime continue to be available.

"These powers will continue to be subject to strict safeguards to ensure the right balance between privacy and protecting the public."
The spokesman said changes need to be made to the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 "to ensure that public authorities can continue to obtain and have access to communications data essential for counter-terrorism and investigation of crime purposes".

But the Information Commission, an independent authority set up to protect personal information, said the database "may well be a step too far" and highlighted the risk of data being lost, traded or stolen.

Assistant information commissioner Jonathan Bamford said: "We are not aware of any justification for the state to hold every UK citizen's phone and internet records. We have real doubts that such a measure can be justified, or is proportionate or desirable.

"Defeating crime and terrorism is of the utmost importance, but we are not aware of any pressing need to justify the government itself holding this sort of data."

'Appalling record'

A number of data protection failures in recent months, including the loss of a CD carrying the personal details of every child benefit claimant, have embarrassed the government.

The plans also prompted concern from political groups.

The shadow home secretary, David Davis, said: "Given [ministers'] appalling record at maintaining the integrity of databases holding people's sensitive data, this could well be more of a threat to our security than a support."

Liberal Democrat home affairs spokesman Chris Huhne called the proposals "an Orwellian step too far".

He said ministers had "taken leave of their senses if they think that this proposal is compatible with a free country and a free people".

"Given the appalling track record of data loss, this state is simply not to be trusted with such private information," said Mr Huhne

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7409593.stm
 
Free country & free people ?... sorry mate I thought you were talking about the UK ? :roflmao:
 
How would this prevent crime or terrorism. At best it would only help police to find the perpetrators. You'd still get the crime. Just like CCTV ( which used to be called 'crime prevention cameras'). I doubt they have prevented one crime.

My message to this poxy government. ' Fu*king leave us alone'
 
this was reported almost two weeks ago.

Right now it is just a proposal, nothing more. The US have been doing this for years to its own citezens and any traffic going through the states.

I cant find the link right now, but it has been reported that the US project was pointless - they captured all this data and didnt have enough resource to make any use of it.

and the comment on CCTV being called crime prevention cameras - where did you get this little nugget? CCTV was developed by the NAZIs to monitor V2 launches, after that it was used as the title suggests, as a closed circuit TV network. It is only in recent times that it has been used to monitor people regarding crime detection etc.

Are you on aspirins on something.
I obviously meant the cameras put up in this country in the last 15 years, and they WERE called 'crime prevention cameras'
 
ive worked in security and armed forces an never heard them being called that either, i have heard the excuse for putting them up of "to prevent crime" which is a load of tosh... the chavs around here nick the bloody things lol.
 
ive worked in security and armed forces an never heard them being called that either, i have heard the excuse for putting them up of "to prevent crime" which is a load of tosh... the chavs around here nick the bloody things lol.

If they are put up 'to prevent crime' doesn't that make them 'crime prevention cameras'.
 
If they are put up 'to prevent crime' doesn't that make them 'crime prevention cameras'.

no that makes them cctv cameras with a bull shat excuse for them being there.

pcso's were brought in to prevent crime, dont call them pcso' crime prevention officers do we ..? no thought not
 
I have never heard of them being called that.

Why would anyone want to try and confuse people that way? CCTV was well established 15 years ago and most people would have known what that meant.

They were called CCTV in shops. In the open they were called 'crime prevention cameras'. Trust me.

I been banging on about it for years.
 
like rs2ooo says - they are just CCTV cameras there to prevent crime.

Plainly a camera cant do this, only a fully trained police officer is capable of that. And then in large numbers.

exactly, Being in a job where i used them daily inside and outside a large shopping centre in essex...they are called CCTV, as in EVERY SIGN you will see about them. If they are called what you say they are in your area then thats what they decide to call them, they are still a CCTV system... Closed Circuit TeleVison,... Thats what its called, simple lol.

Call it what you like, its still a CCTV system.
 
Well most modern systems do not employ "closed ciruits" and can be accessed via the internet so they aint CCTV are they ?
 
no that makes them cctv cameras with a bull shat excuse for them being there.

pcso's were brought in to prevent crime, dont call them pcso' crime prevention officers do we ..? no thought not

Here's a quote from a random newspaper on Google;

'And 21 crime prevention cameras have been now been installed in the borough’s smaller towns to help prevent envirocrime and anti-social behaviour.'

Even New Zealand;

"Crime Prevention Cameras in Public Places

Policy updated November 2003

Introduction

Police may support local authorities and other groups wanting to install closed circuit television cameras in public places for crime prevention purposes. The objective of installing the cameras is to reduce the incidence of crime and disorder, so members of the community feel safe when visiting the public areas covered by the cameras."
 
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@ karym6 and rs2ooo16valve :

Are you two eating the same treacle?

It doesn't matter what the technical name for the bloody things is. They are put up as 'crime prevention cameras' and that was how they were conned onto the public.
 
these "camera's" - if that isnt too contentious a term - can only prevent crime if poorly fitted, there is a high wind, and the criminal inpotentia is in exactly the right place lol
 
Why is everybody getting so worked up over a government Database for phone calls and emails, isn't there a place in Cheltenham that has been doing this for years?

Lets face it the everyday Joe Bloggs don't even notice that they are tagged everywhere they go, Jump into a car and be sure a camera will pick you, on motorways, in towns even on country roads , but you only notice when you get a speeding ticket, when you use your credit or debit card they know where you were at some given time and date.
Does it make any difference to your way of life ? I dont think so.

As for me they can monitor my emails,phone calls,credit cards I don't give a shti as I have nothing to hide.
 
Its is kind of in place now as the ISP's & Telecoms have to by law keep their records for 7 years I think

All the goverment want to do is centralize all the information and maybe keep it a bit longer
 
it's only an issue when they put the data on a disk and them lose them in transit although if they've been encrypted adequetly then it's not a problem.
 
They were called CCTV in shops. In the open they were called 'crime prevention cameras'. Trust me.

I been banging on about it for years.

like rs2ooo says - they are just CCTV cameras there to prevent crime.

Plainly a camera cant do this, only a fully trained police officer is capable of that. And then in large numbers.

exactly, Being in a job where i used them daily inside and outside a large shopping centre in essex...they are called CCTV, as in EVERY SIGN you will see about them. If they are called what you say they are in your area then thats what they decide to call them, they are still a CCTV system... Closed Circuit TeleVison,... Thats what its called, simple lol.

Call it what you like, its still a CCTV system.

Well most modern systems do not employ "closed ciruits" and can be accessed via the internet so they aint CCTV are they ?

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN

IN THE BLUE CORNER WE HAVE COMMON SENSE REPRESENTED BY FUBAR69 AND PIPSQUEAKER, IN THE RED CORNER REPRESENTING PERIOD PAINS WE HAVE....

Sadly I think a lot of the debate on this forum is heading this way. I have been involved in a tiff or two but for Gods sake why the need to split hairs on such a common sense matter. Isn't is glaringly obvious that the camera's are put up to prevent crime? Surely with the natural flow of things it would not be unreasonable to call them crime prevention cameras, or do we need a DW referendum on this?

I think pointless bickering such as this will prevent new people from posting in these rooms.

karym6 I would urge you to stop constantly correcting people (or incorrecting in this case if there is such a term). There simply is not need for it. It stops the natural flow the discussion could take.
 
Why is everybody getting so worked up over a government Database for phone calls and emails, isn't there a place in Cheltenham that has been doing this for years?

Lets face it the everyday Joe Bloggs don't even notice that they are tagged everywhere they go, Jump into a car and be sure a camera will pick you, on motorways, in towns even on country roads , but you only notice when you get a speeding ticket, when you use your credit or debit card they know where you were at some given time and date.
Does it make any difference to your way of life ? I dont think so.

As for me they can monitor my emails,phone calls,credit cards I don't give a shti as I have nothing to hide.

Totally agree Topdog
 
By definiton, both FUBAR and pipsqueaker were incorrect. CCTV has never been marketed to the masses as a crime prevention camera, and most modern CCTV systems are just that, closed-circuit. They could never be anything more than this regardless of any Internet functionality.


It is like talking to a brick wall ? :err:

By definition ? we don't care what it was "marketed" as, "BY DEFINITION" a system that aint closed cannot be called a CLOSED CIRCUIT !!!
 
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