First UK ID cards are unveiled

[Seedy_r0m]

The card bears the royal crest plus the shamrock, daffodil, thistle and rose representing the four countries of UK


The first UK identity card for more than 60 years will start to be issued in November, the Government announced today.
Jacqui Smith unveiled the card which is to be issued to people outside the European economic area renewing their permission to stay in the UK as students or on the basis of marriage.
Up to 60,000 cards will be handed out between November and March in the first large scale production of the 4.7bn identity card scheme.
The red and blue card bears the royal crest plus the shamrock, daffodil, thistle and rose as symbols representing the four countries making up the United Kingdom.

It bears the person’s picture, name, date of birth, their status in the UK and whether they have a right to work. On the back the card gives the person’s town and country of birth, gender and whether they have the right to UK state benefits.
The biometric details are the person’s two fingerprints.

Ms Smith, the Home Secretary, said the card, which will cost £30, will replace up to 50 paper documents. “ID cards for foreign nationals will replace old fashioned paper documents; make it easier for employers and sponsors to check entitlement to work and study and for the UK border agency to verify someone’s identity."

The card, which is compulsory for foreign nationals, will start to be issued on November 25 at offices in Croydon, Glasgow, Sheffield, Liverpool, Birmingham and Cardiff. Over the next three years up to one million will be issued to foreign nationals in Britain.

Ms Smith added: “Foreign nationals living and working here and studying here legally will be able to prove that easily and we will be able to prevent those here illegally from benefiting.”

Ms Smith said that next year identity cards will start to be issued to UK citizens working in sensitive areas including those employed airside at airports.

It is understood the issuing of these cards will be trialled first at a handful of airports and they will only be issued to new applicants for jobs rather than existing staff.

Under current plans identity cards will start to be issued on a voluntary basis to UK citizens from 2010 with the Government initially targeting youngsters over 16 who may wish to have them to help prove their identity and age.

From 2011/12 ministers hope to start rolling out the scheme throughout the UK with people able to apply for an identity card, passport or both at a cost of just under £100.

The card issued to UK citizens will differ in the information displayed from that given to foreign nationals.

It will include a picture, name, gender, place and date of birth, issue an expiry date of the card, national identity register number, nationality and two fingerprints but does not have details of a person’s right to work or access to benefits.

Although identity cards issued to foreign nationals are compulsory, UK citizens will not have to apply, or carry one. It will require further legislation to make it compulsory for every UK citizen aged 16 or over to have an ID card and require them to produce it when seeking employment or accessing public services.

From Times Online

September 25, 2008

 

[seanicca]

The card bears the royal crest plus the shamrock, daffodil, thistle and rose representing the four countries of UK


The first UK identity card for more than 60 years will start to be issued in November, the Government announced today.
Jacqui Smith unveiled the card which is to be issued to people outside the European economic area renewing their permission to stay in the UK as students or on the basis of marriage.
Up to 60,000 cards will be handed out between November and March in the first large scale production of the 4.7bn identity card scheme.
The red and blue card bears the royal crest plus the shamrock, daffodil, thistle and rose as symbols representing the four countries making up the United Kingdom.

It bears the person’s picture, name, date of birth, their status in the UK and whether they have a right to work. On the back the card gives the person’s town and country of birth, gender and whether they have the right to UK state benefits.
The biometric details are the person’s two fingerprints.

Ms Smith, the Home Secretary, said the card, which will cost £30, will replace up to 50 paper documents. “ID cards for foreign nationals will replace old fashioned paper documents; make it easier for employers and sponsors to check entitlement to work and study and for the UK border agency to verify someone’s identity."

The card, which is compulsory for foreign nationals, will start to be issued on November 25 at offices in Croydon, Glasgow, Sheffield, Liverpool, Birmingham and Cardiff. Over the next three years up to one million will be issued to foreign nationals in Britain.

Ms Smith added: “Foreign nationals living and working here and studying here legally will be able to prove that easily and we will be able to prevent those here illegally from benefiting.”

Ms Smith said that next year identity cards will start to be issued to UK citizens working in sensitive areas including those employed airside at airports.

It is understood the issuing of these cards will be trialled first at a handful of airports and they will only be issued to new applicants for jobs rather than existing staff.

Under current plans identity cards will start to be issued on a voluntary basis to UK citizens from 2010 with the Government initially targeting youngsters over 16 who may wish to have them to help prove their identity and age.

From 2011/12 ministers hope to start rolling out the scheme throughout the UK with people able to apply for an identity card, passport or both at a cost of just under £100.

The card issued to UK citizens will differ in the information displayed from that given to foreign nationals.

It will include a picture, name, gender, place and date of birth, issue an expiry date of the card, national identity register number, nationality and two fingerprints but does not have details of a person’s right to work or access to benefits.

Although identity cards issued to foreign nationals are compulsory, UK citizens will not have to apply, or carry one. It will require further legislation to make it compulsory for every UK citizen aged 16 or over to have an ID card and require them to produce it when seeking employment or accessing public services.

From Times Online

September 25, 2008

if people have nothing to hide then they shouldn't be bothered with ID cards, i've got nowt to hide so i'll have one

 

[cliffy]

if people have nothing to hide then they shouldn't be bothered with ID cards, i've got nowt to hide so i'll have one

shouldnt be bothered ? maybe ppl dont have nothing to hide, but also maybe ppl havnt got £30 to waste i no i havnt. If they want me to have one fine, but be fcuked if im paying for it.

 

[havelln]

i would never buy one what a waste of 30 pound i got me driving license and passport what do i need one of them for if they make them mandatory for every one i illl be the first in court for telling them to f off

 

[Seedy_r0m]

These will be issued at a cost of £30 to foreign nationals from outwith the EEC, I have no problem with that.

They could even charge for other EEC member countries & I wouldn't bat an eyelid.

They should be free to UK nationals though.

 

[adam]

if people have nothing to hide.....

wow are people still really using that line?

 

[hawkish]

Whats the point - you just know that we will all be good citizens and pay up and then some prolaterian scummer will get caught outside a stab victims house with the bloody blade in their hands and video evidence on their mobile and some smart arsed body will get them off charges by saying its human nature to kill ourselves and by stopping him killing will mess with his human rights or some other shit and we will send him to the carribean for a fortnight then pay for him to live for the rest of his life.

meanwhile a law abiding hard working, tax paying citizen is walking in the street on a windy day. they put some litter in a bin but as they walk past it blows out the other side - the cctv sees him so hes picked up, his id card is swiped the chip in his head is tagged , his biometric detail is logged and cross analized to do a background check on all his family before he is fined to within an inch of his life and has to miss a mortgage payment and feed his family on baked beans for 6 months.

The sort of people this is aimed at keeping an eye on just wont sign up and the rest of us will just find ourselves an easier target for misdemenor arrests to keep the crime solved cases up.

1 unsolved murder + 1 caught smoker in a bus shelter = 0

F**K it - im not signing up to it - just another step closer to 1984

 

[GaryLpool]

I agree M8, I am also led to believe that the Cards have an RFID chip in them but not confirmed at this stage ? 1984 ...Too true.... Just more ways for the inland Revenue to tax you to death !! see how much you are spending and where you are going .... stuff that nosey b's

Gary

 

[FUBAR69]

Biometric passports

DNA Databases

CCTV

ID Cards

Roadside Fingerprinting

Subdermal Chips

RFID

Government Dept's. selling personal data for £2:50 a pop

Where exactly does this sh*t stop ?.... I am sick to the hind teeth with peeps giving it the old "if you have nothing to hide" crap.... this country is worse than Nazi occupied France for crying out loud !

Do some of you live in a Bubble ? :slaps:

I love the way that we all like to think that "our" government is better than anyone else's but reality is they are a bunch of sh*theads that don't give 2 rats arses about you or I's security.... it does not matter if we do not want id cards..... they will just use the "Creeping Jesus" approach and before you know it the ones without one will be in the minority......

Meanwhile back at the Ranch..... the majority of us are too worried about the next episode of feckin Corry or some other mind numbing drivel to actually look round us and see whats going on....


How sad....

 

[Kruger]

I agree M8, I am also led to believe that the Cards have an RFID chip in them but not confirmed at this stage ? 1984 ...Too true.... Just more ways for the inland Revenue to tax you to death !! see how much you are spending and where you are going .... stuff that nosey b's

Gary

m8 the banks know all this the now.

if you wanted to start business and wanted demographic info, i would goto the bank, they know what everyone earns, and what they spend it on and were you are when you bought it, so taking banks, mobile phones the powers at be can tell everything about the now already without the ID cards.

 

[FUBAR69]

given that subdermal chips are a complete fantasy, what makes you think that the majority of the people living this country are either a) all behaving themselves all of the time and b) have the right to live here?

Its hard to understand how you can accuse people of living in a bubble when you miss out fundamental points like this. Essentially, if you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to worry about. This isnt a massive ploy to control the populace, it is in part a response to calls from the public to control things like crime and illegal immigration.

You cant have it both ways.

Sorry I forgot that you had PHD is subdermal technology...... in other words you aint got a clue if they are fantasy or not.

And what makes you think I believe that everyone is behaving themselves ?

And as for "illegal" immegrants, don't make me laugh.... the country is awash with people who are not from this country.... where is this "public outcry" that you are talking about ?

I don't care if I am not doing anything wrong or not... that is neither here nor there.... I have a right to privacy...

Aint it funny how the Nazi's used very similar scare tactics to force ever more security rules and laws..... suppose that was just to control the crime and immigrants too .......

NB. the states have been using subdermal transmitters for years :tongue:

 

[FUBAR69]

oh dear, off down the garden path again. Such a shame as this started as a sensible thread.

Subdermal chips are used to track animals. Do you honestly think that the Uk would all of a sudden just say yes to doctors installing chips in us? Get a grip.

The public outcry on immigration is evident on this forum. There have been a number of comments here stating that we should not allow them etc. And there are plenty of reports in the news about immigration targets etc.

Also, could you provide the links etc to Nazi security policy so that we can all see and contrast them to our present situation? I would hate to think we only need to rely on your paranoid vision of the UK.

I thought that subdermal chips were a "complete fantasy" according to you?

Do you really need a link to Nazi's and the way they operated ?..... they were the dudes in the funky black uniforms with the red arm bands and FMB's.... if you seriously need any links to the part of the history lesson you obviously missed then get back to me and I will list several thousand of them.

On a serious note, do you actually see no issue with the persistant derigation of our human rights and freedoms ?...... do we deserve no privacy at all ?... must the government know how many lumps of corn were in my last movement ?

I take it you are ok with the government taking your newborn childs DNA at birth ?..... we have not had to carry ID cards in this country for over 60 years..... if we are seriously getting to the stage where we need to carry them again should we not be asking WHY ?....

There is far more of and "outcry" about the amount of government interference in our "private" lifes than any immigrant issues we may have....

 

[FUBAR69]

Subdermal chips by your definition are a complete fantasy. My definition ? :err:

At school we were taught how the Nazis operated, lots of info on the use of propaganda to scare the populace into thinking they were not safe etc, and to trust noone around them, leading to people accusing their neighbours of comitting crimes. Sound familiar ?

When it comes to my childs DNA on record at birth, why wouldnt I want that? I mean, you can shout, whinge and stamp your feet in your normal manner - but what exactly is the problem with them having this info? There is no invasion of privacy so far, the only problem I would have is that the NHS would be collecting it, and they are guff at holding onto it...

No invasion of privacy by taking DNA ? ......... Just out of curiosity..... what exactly would the government need to do to breach your privacy in your opinion ?.....

I know it might seem like a very personal question by since you dont seem to mind Tom, Dick & Harry knowing your biz.......

 

[hawkish]

Yawn - yet another have-the-last-word thread from karmy there must be tons of actives in this exact state now . over 4000 posts - 3000 completely unneeded and mostly unwanted:RABBIT:.

 

[FUBAR69]

Fubar, in my opinion a breach of privacy would be the government asking me what I do day in and day out. They dont do that - a hundred other private companies do.

Well I simply must cherish my privacy more than your good self, but I do believe that I should be the one to decide how much of my personal info gets passed to anyone.....not the government



Each to their own...

 

[hawkish]

what a wonderful contribution. .

sorry mate but someones got to say it - lots of us are getting bored with you ruining threads just because you enjoy to annoy people in your own abbrasive manner. Your a text cancer of DW and I for one am standing up and asking you to tone it down.

Do you really want to have this name for yourself? Its pissing everyone off

 

[gooner71]

@Karym6 - this id card is the thin edge of the wedge!!

Why in a "free" and i use the term loosely these days - would we need the government to keep tabs on the whole population? I can understand issuing cards to student visitors or asylum seekers as it could help with security and be useful for confirming residential status. Other than that there is no need for people born here to carry such a card!!

I've heard all the arguements about "if you are not doing anything wrong then you have no need to worry...." but the law states that you are innocent until proven guilty so why should I be made to feel like a criminal and pretty much prove my whereabouts at all times?? I personally think its outrageous to use the scare tactics about terrorism to push through draconian laws that are against our civil liberties.

If we dont make a stand now it will only get worse...... A DNA database is already taking shape - did you know that if you are arrested on suspician of any crime your DNA will be taken and even if charges are never brought, the DNA sample remains on file ...forever!!! If, as is suggested, DNA is taken from newborn babies when the heel prick test is done then within two generations 90% of the populations profile will be stored. This may not sound too terrible, but this government can't hold onto your bank details? What about if your insurance company got hold of this info and refused life insurance for anyone with a predisposition for heart disease or cancer??? This is not science ficiton - genetic markers are very much used in medicine already so its not a giant leap!!

Immigration could easily be controlled by a closed border policy - anyone wanting to come here could apply for a visa before setting off and those with a genuine reason for being here would have no trouble at all - as for asylum seekers who are fleeing danger then unless they are coming in by plane (unlikely) almost everyone else will have at least had to pass through a neighbouring country (we dont get many applications from French or Eire nationals) so surely under the Geneva convention they should be accomodated at their first port of call - not be allowed onward passage to an already overcrowded island? Oh and before anyone starts banging on about us not being overcrowded in the great scheme of things - im not just talking about a specific area of land per person here - im refering to the overun NHS and other public services and housing shortages etc...

Anyway I for one wont be having an ID card and they can drag my arse to the local prison and keep me there for as long as they want - but im banking on the fact that the rebellion will be that big that they cant possibly jail 20 million of us!!!!

 

[topdog1965]

Read all the posts and some interesting points made, but I fail to see how it will affect me, I am an ordinary Joe public will this ID card stop me having a mortgage, bank account, credit card, car, will it stop me going on holiday , and all the fore mentioned are monitored and they even log your phone calls emails so what is going to be different,DNA well all that means is if I kill someone chances are they will catch me faster

@Gooner71 the law states that you are innocent until proven guilty

I think it says "presumed innocent until proven guilty"

 

[mas123]

@ FUBAR69.

I think your buying in to the media hype a bit too much. IMO the media hype stuff up a lot just to get eye catching headlines and sell papers... its their job...

I don't think the situation is as bad as you describe...

Just my opinion, don't want to get in to an argumentroud:

 

[Seedy_r0m]

I wouldn't get too worked about the ID card folks.

They have stated that UK citizens do NOT have to apply for, nor carry one.

If they do make it compulsory for UK citizens to carry this, then that takes it to a completely different level.

It will include a picture, name, gender, place and date of birth, issue an expiry date of the card,
national identity register number, nationality and two fingerprints but does not have details of a person’s right to work or access to benefits.

The information contained in the UK version is hardly sensitive info.

Most people already carry a driving license, bank card, credit card, mobile phone etc, these things combined can supply detailed information about your name, address, date of birth, spending habits, friends, family, can track your movement around the country & pretty much anywhere in the world etc

I'd prefer the ID cards to contain extra info (highly encoded) such as:

Blood type
Next of kin
Address
Driving Licence details
Medication/medical history (like a Talisman SOS)

This extra info could work in the holders favour rather than against them.