Clone boxes destroyed by gemini

[mgb]

OK,

let's try that again.

DMM have a least in Germany if not in the whole of Europe the patent on their developed product and Software.

DMM own the brand "Dreambox" and they own the copyright at the drivers inside the head.ko. Thats it.

 

[tradmusicman]

DMM own the brand "Dreambox" and they own the copyright at the drivers inside the head.ko. Thats it.

BUT ... Do they own the software they are using to carry the clone bomb in.

 

[mgb]

The head.ko carry the killer virus and the action is to erase the bootloader.

 

[pt-1]

I just think we disagree. I do not care much for copyright, especially a copyright that enables people to steal cable television (yes I know people use them for legal reasons, but lets not play who can be the cutest. They are linux based techy boxes for hackers) . I also think that the majority of people on here feel the same way, otherwise they would not be stealing cable in the first place.



Forgive me if I am not understanding what you are implying, but I infer from this that the German police can recover stolen property (physical) and the owner has no recompense. Well it is the same here in the UK. However, there is a big difference between physical property and intellectual property. I would be surprised if (to use my earlier analogy) German police were taking fake nike shirts of peoples backs in Berlin.



Here is a list on the official DMM site of resellers in the UK. This sort of blows the 'DMM is holier than thou, and they don't support piracy' argument now doesn't it?



I refer to my earlier link. Dream Multimedia do and have supply cable boxes to the UK (where there is a monopoly). The only reason for people to buy a box is to stick DW 2.0 on it and get free porn. Will they admit to it? No.

Then they start to try and spread viruses. It is a dirty trick. When they admit it and come back into the fold, we can begin to appreciate again them for what they have done for us.

Lets agree to disagree. You think that companies have the right to protect their proprietary ideas by spreading viruses to kill clones of said intellectual copyright. I think it is a stretch to far, bad form, and it sets a dangerous precedent.

Both the UK Companies sell Satellite Boxes and this is legal ...

We can keep this going but I think DMM have all right to protect their development

And no,
the Dbox was originally not developed to get free PayTv

 

[mozr]

1. this

is a dm500c supplied by an offical reseller of DMM products. Not just satellite boxes.

2. Fair enough. I may have overstepped the mark with that. I didn't mean they designed it with illegality in mind. However, its a nice bonus that they can sell them for that very purpose. The fact that they are supplying them in a monopolized cable market, knowing what the only reason is to buy one in the UK, is in my opinion showing a culpable nod and a wink, rather than an a public endoresment. This again I believe makes their stance with the virus hypocritical.

 

[pt-1]

1. this

is a dm500c supplied by an offical reseller of DMM products. Not just satellite boxes.

2. Fair enough. I may have overstepped the mark with that. I didn't mean they designed it with illegality in mind. However, its a nice bonus that they can sell them for that very purpose. The fact that they are supplying them in a monopolized cable market, knowing what the only reason is to buy one in the UK, is in my opinion showing a culpable nod and a wink, rather than an a public endoresment. This again I believe makes their stance with the virus hypocritical.

And again,

a company selling a product might not be aware of the individual situation in each country.

Mainly the reason for this post is that some Foreign Company copied someones idea and now that someone fights back

 

[mgb]

Killing the bootloader is not the right way to fight back.
And once more there is no patent for the whole box idea.
The mainboard at the dreamboxes is based at the reference board from IBM, the producer of the mpc cpu.

 

[calhordas]

Hi


yes alot of DM500-S /envision/dvb/eagles/extremebpx/inet boxes with image 4.3.1 gone down bootloader corrupt.

The only way 100% guaranteed at the moment is by flash dump with universal programmer.

If you have a box with this problem or know anyone with the problem PM me i can fix it.

I have done a few fix's in the last couple of days.

It has nothing to do with cheap tunners or any kind of HW but instead is a SW problem as they kill the bootloader.

If bootloader is dead bot will not comunicate with pc via COM PORT or LAN until bootloader is flashed again with proper boot file.

Cheers
Calhordas

 

[max_gee]

found this

www.dreamboxrepair.com

 

[max_gee]

Killing the bootloader is not the right way to fight back.
And once more there is no patent for the whole box idea.
The mainboard at the dreamboxes is based at the reference board from IBM, the producer of the mpc cpu.

What about the contenets of the bootloader, surely that is copyrighted / patiented?

 

[trackermut]

Can you blame Dream for fighting back against 500,600 and 7020 clones ( and yes Gemini team is sponsored by dream ). This is only the latest change from gemini over six weeks ago they made announcement that they will not be supporting any boxes except for dream, now they change .ko and yes going for sat system. All well document on sat forums ( i have also info from some saying jtag will not work cant confirm). But why not would you stand by and watch your company be destroyed by cheap Chinese imports from china who dont sponsor teams or pay for development.

Dream are not the company they once where and a failure on 800 and 8000 will see there demise if anything they waited to long.

500 have been of the market for over a year now

dont get me wrong not in support of dreams actions but they are only fighting there corner.

 

[mozr]

I agree they that they have a right to protect there investment. They do not have a right to spread a virus that kills hardware im sorry.

Believing the the end does not justify any means to get there.

Even M$ know that. If they spread an update that detected duplicate keys/ modified registry entries and formatted the drive there would be an uproar, so all they do is promote COA and genuine liscensed software, whilst disabling some functionality until the matter is resolved. That is responsible patent/copyright protection.

Gemini tried to block installs of latest images from working. This easily got hacked so they got pissed off, and went to far.

End of.

 

[velvitjester69]

Can you blame Dream for fighting back against 500,600 and 7020 clones ( and yes Gemini team is sponsored by dream ). This is only the latest change from gemini over six weeks ago they made announcement that they will not be supporting any boxes except for dream, now they change .ko and yes going for sat system. All well document on sat forums ( i have also info from some saying jtag will not work cant confirm). But why not would you stand by and watch your company be destroyed by cheap Chinese imports from china who dont sponsor teams or pay for development.

Dream are not the company they once where and a failure on 800 and 8000 will see there demise if anything they waited to long.

500 have been of the market for over a year now

dont get me wrong not in support of dreams actions but they are only fighting there corner.

The whole reason Dream are failing is because they are being too greedy.They have a monopoly on linux boxes and charge extortionite prices.

eg the new dream 800 should not cost more than 250 euro,which is very expensive anyway but no,dream charge 450 euro

Its there own fault people are buying clones,I for one will not buy a real DMM product until they stop abusing their monopoly position and ripping off the consumers.

Dream could solve the problem if they simply lowered their price,they would actually probably make more money because they would sell X2 the amount of boxes they sell now.

 

[trackermut]

So you want Dream to compete with clone prices clone boxes are made in china with no development costs no support costs and no warranty costs, how can they do this as far as i can remember original dreambox 500 cost 150 quid at the same time 130 for eurovox and 110 for starview one, how is that expensive when they came with a 2 year warranty and support from manufacture, yeah keep buying clone boxes and they will be no further developments.

Virus what virus this is a program written to work on there on product. would you complain if you flashed a starview with eurovox software and it did not work. they are protecting there interests and there future as stated dont agree but they are fighting for survival.


if you want to pay 60 quid for a clone and its bricked well thats your risk dont bleat at dream cause you bought a cheap knock off and they will not support it.

Next we will want Branson to broadcast for free because no one will support clone development.

 

[velvitjester69]

So you want Dream to compete with clone prices clone boxes are made in china with no development costs no support costs and no warranty costs, how can they do this as far as i can remember original dreambox 500 cost 150 quid at the same time 130 for eurovox and 110 for starview one, how is that expensive when they came with a 2 year warranty and support from manufacture, yeah keep buying clone boxes and they will be no further developments.

Virus what virus this is a program written to work on there on product. would you complain if you flashed a starview with eurovox software and it did not work. they are protecting there interests and there future as stated dont agree but they are fighting for survival.


if you want to pay 60 quid for a clone and its bricked well thats your risk dont bleat at dream cause you bought a cheap knock off and they will not support it.

Next we will want Branson to broadcast for free because no one will support clone development.

no,of course im not.Dream are still ripping people off.In reality the dm800 costs about 60 quid to make and development is about the same again.Dream are ripping people off and until they learn to respect the consumers they will suffer.

you can say all you want about warranty and development costs.The reality is euro for a dreambox 800 is laughable

 

[trackermut]

and what relavance does the 800 box have to the clone killing dm500??
Its no wonder its so expensive with all the new anti-piracy things they have needed to invest in.

 

[velvitjester69]

and what relavance does the 800 box have to the clone killing dm500??
Its no wonder its so expensive with all the new anti-piracy things they have needed to invest in.

its just an example of their ridiculous pricing structures across their whole range.

 

[trackermut]

But the price isnt the topic of discussion here,,, if you dont like the price buy a cheaper box,, i.e a patched box.
Supporting the clone 500 has only made things worse for now everyone.
you only get what you pay for in this world.... Only people are now taking the moral high ground want all the dream products, dream software, dream source code but only pay half the cost of what it should. simple as that.
If they were not ripp-offs and spent ANY cash into development they would have there own bootloader and wouldnt require to use dreams( which is patanted and copyrighted ), so as much as I really think this was a dirty way to do it,, its ESSENTIAL for dream to protect its dealers and now even 600 and 7020 being cloned it can only get worse,,, but only if people like yourself keep on this 'i will never buy a original dreambox'.. well then you better get yourself a linux pc setup or at least cross-compiling tools and develop yourself a new bootloader.. Coz this will only be the start of the clone bombs,,, be sure of that.

 

[velvitjester69]

But the price isnt the topic of discussion here,,, if you dont like the price buy a cheaper box,, i.e a patched box.
Supporting the clone 500 has only made things worse for now everyone.
you only get what you pay for in this world.... Only people are now taking the moral high ground want all the dream products, dream software, dream source code but only pay half the cost of what it should. simple as that.
If they were not ripp-offs and spent ANY cash into development they would have there own bootloader and wouldnt require to use dreams( which is patanted and copyrighted ), so as much as I really think this was a dirty way to do it,, its ESSENTIAL for dream to protect its dealers and now even 600 and 7020 being cloned it can only get worse,,, but only if people like yourself keep on this 'i will never buy a original dreambox'.. well then you better get yourself a linux pc setup or at least cross-compiling tools and develop yourself a new bootloader.. Coz this will only be the start of the clone bombs,,, be sure of that.

I understand what you are saying and I agree this has gone way off topic.You said that if they didnt stop making clones and if the dm800 isnt a success it could be the demise of the company.I was making the point that I feel their pricing is the reason people are turning to clones and Thus they are responsible from that aspect.If clones are destroying the company then all they have to do is stop being so greedy and people will buy official DM products and the company can thrive.

I never said I wont buy and official DM product,I will-when they reduce their ridiculous prices.They arent sony or pioneer and development costs and manufacturing costs do not come anywhere close to explaining the ludacris prices DM stick on their products.

also I dont expect them to compete with clone prices but I expect them to be resonable about their pricing.

 

[trackermut]

So you know what about development costs?, or are you just guessing 4 years the 8000 has been in development and in courts battling for hdmi licence now a turn around and in my option the wrong road taken with dvi, you tell me how much dream has spent to bring the 8000 to market ( market still not here unless you are Russian).

name me one clone seller that's done anything for Linux development.