Creating a wired nwtwork?

bert1

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I've always tried to stay clear of this topic because it seemed too complicated and if things aint broke,dont fix them-but I think the time has come to make a proper effort...(and possibly save meself some cash)

I have a wired router connected to my pc at moment.....with broadband connection.

I want to create a network that includes:-

1 My main desktop PC (there is a scanner/copier/printer connected here plus some other stuff eg internet phone,programmer.)
2 My Lap Top
3 A dreambox
4 A slingbox

(I dont have items 3& 4 yet-but that is the intention of all this)

Am I right in thinking its easier to try and set this up with all equipment connected so that all automatic processing is fully utilised?-tried a run through but did not press save at the last because i wasnt too sure as i lost use of my printer when i tried before)

How do I make the network secure? Would like to access it myself from another location with my laptop, plus may also want to make it available to other individuals.

then my real problems start with a dmbox LOL -tried before and thought too complicated.

If a reply to this is too long to type-would appreciate a link .....

as you can see my knowledge of networking is pretty poor and contributed greatly to my last dreambox failure.

One other question - i have three seperate sockets around the house with broadband filters on them. Only 1 makes use of broadband at the mo. Is it possible to connect a second modem/router to the one downstairs(with another pc of course) and access the
internet simultaneously ? It is relevant to my earlier question as the answer will tell me how i must run the ethernet cable to the sat box. The sat box is on different a floor to the desktop!-

thanks

Bert
 
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I dont have any useful links so i'm hoping others will answer this post as well bert. I'm no expert but I'd like to say that networks always seem extremely complex and confusing when its your first, but they are so simple that you will be surprised! Its similar to adding phoneline extensions- you can have various phones or a fax machine or an answer machine or pc spread all over your house but they all go back to the 1 single BT main socket in your home, before that cable then goes outside to connect to the BT telegraph pole etc.

You cant use 2 routers at the same time on the same phoneline, so forget that bit. You have to choose your main phone socket that you want to use, then put the Router near that. Once the router is plugged in then that will be your 'broadband supply'. Now all you do is run cables from the 'broadband supply' to every network item that you want to connect (see the basic image attached).

So its that simple. You may (or may not) have minor problems when setting each item up but if the wiring is correct then the problem can be solved. If you have 1 pc set up and working then just adding more items will be easy- just like plugging in a BT phone extension lead, picking phone up and getting dial tone. Mostly it should be- plug in and the network works automatically, sets your internal IP and job done, so no need to worry at all.

The dreambox is just another simple pc, the network part is very basic, the software you use on it will be another subject but networking will just be the same as adding a 3rd computer. The slingbox will be the same, its just a very basic 'computer' that will automatically get network IP from your router and will be connected instantly.

The router has settings and you can configure it to suit you. So if you get a problem it will usually be that the router settings and the connected equipment do not match in some way. So you change a setting to match, but with 'DHCP' enabled then usually these settings will be completely automatic. The additional settings in the router will be for controlling security and your own access from outside your home, or for allowing others the access etc. Its all just settings that you can tweak to suit your needs, but 1 step at a time :).

Now if you dont have enough ethernet sockets & need extra connections in your router; or you need 2 or 3 or more pc's say upstairs and the broadband router is downstairs, then you can use a 'switch' which is just like using a splitter on a co-ax cable (but better). But i dont want to complicate things, just saying that there are solutions for different problems, you only need 1 cable running from upstairs to downstairs.
I have 7 'units' running on my network that all have a connection in some way into the router- the broadband connection point. They all have internet and dont affect each other in any way. Hardware security & settings stops access to my network at the router, but i also have the usual firewall & extra security on my pc too, but outwards they all connect to wherever needed.

So get the wiring right and you will be surprised how easy it is. It just seems difficult at a glance but it really isnt, especially with help from members here if anything doesnt go right 1st time.
 
As you can see m8-im exploring other options after our large dish converstaion...

I managed to get some prices for 1 piece dish over there- ranging from 500euro for 1.8m
to 1500 euro for 2.7m prices seem to double for each bigger size after this.my contact may be able to beat these prices-but he does not yet have a website.

So a look at again at networking seemed a sensible 1 to save cash in my intentions and 2- because its about time I learned how to do this anyway....

The main cabling is already in place - broadband to router obviously
desktop pc to router
the ethernet cable from the router to a sling or dream is in place
so just one more cable would be required for the other item

so thats 3 of the 4 ethernet ports catered for and could hook my lap top up if i wanted.......

Anyway it seems that it may even be as simple as plug & play from here-hope so!....let you know how i get on.
 
Told you i was confused...LOL-Been ages trying to get the router working after resetting-it appears i had the correct settings but the router takes a short while to clear itself-didnt touch anything,turned back on and working again........

SUCCESS- I have internet on main PC and laptop PC simultaneously-so as far as the cabling side and plugin and play goes-all is fine....

What I still dont get is:-

Have I been confusing things by looking in the create network wizard in XP when I should be looking at config settings on the router-(Id completely forgotten about it and how to access it via internet explorer)

Secondly- do i need to name my equipment or am I confusing this with another set up method that connects all equipment to the desktop pc rather than a router ?

Finally what passwords / IP addresses/ codes are relevant to access this set up from another location via broadband.?

and if you can make me understand that I'll buy you a beer !

Bert
 
ok so far thats what i was meaning by -easy. Getting it plugged in and internet access for each 'item'.

The wizard bit to create network and naming your equipment is to do with accessing different files stored on different pc's that you share on your own network. For instance if you want your laptop to access your music files stored on your main pc then thats when you need to share stuff via the network. Now if you want to set up this one so that you can access your computer with your laptop and access your laptop with your computer then that is where you will need more than my help :). Told you i'm no expert. For instance if you are planning to log in to your computer from your laptop while abroad then afaik you will need some kind of professional networking software to do this safely. I heard of 'pcanywhere' but i think thats old and maybe someone else can suggest more on that because i dont know.

IP address (like a telephone number). There will be 2 types, your Internal IP and External IP. Your External IP is the number that is given by your internet supplier and is used as you travel the internet. The Internal is just a set of numbers used on your own equipment to keep them seperate. The internal stuff will be getting IP's automatic at the moment, thats how they worked 'plug n play'. So for instance, your router may be set at- 192.168.1.1 and your main pc will be 192.168.1.2 and your laptop will be 192.168.1.3 and then your dreambox will become 192.168.1.4 and so on etc. You can see these set IP's by going into your router menus.

_http://www.ip-adress.com/
Go to this webpage to see your 'external' IP address (write it down). This will be where you would "go" when you log in from somewhere else in the world. This external IP can change everytime you reset your router, but that depends on your internet provider and if it does change eveytime we can solve this so dont worry for now.
Passwords would depend on your professional netowrking software that i mentioned above, but I can only comment on the dreambox really cos thats more simple. The dreambox password you set yourself and when you are set up, to log into it you can just use a normal web-browser like InternetExplorer or Firefox. But to do this you 'forward ports'. That sounds technical, basically you go into your router and set rules to suit, like for instance you have to tell your router to send traffic on port 23 to/from your dreambox which will have an Internal IP of maybe 192.168.1.4 -this port forwarding stuff you can follow a tutorial on- portforward.com where you can look up your model of router. But tbh you wouldnt discuss your port numbers in public so I'd help privately on that, same as helping with your dreambox passwords ;). Your router will also have a password that you can change too, but password security is just the last step as an extra precaution anyway.

The slingbox will come with instructions (i dont know the ports used). You will set port forward rules that match the slingbox, so for instance in the router menu (follow the portforward.com tutorial for your router) you would set in the relevant boxes- port range '80' to go to '192.168.1.5' and the slingbox will have its own security password you could set seperately. Now when you then go to another location, you type in your laptop browser say ~ 82.11.12.13 (your external ip for uk) and your IntExplorer uses port 80 to access router which then gets sent to your slingbox, which then asks for password; so on your screen you would log in and then you'd get your slingbox software showing on your laptop.

So as for understanding I think it will be- IP's external & internal; ports which is where traffic flows. IP's i explained above, Ports just depend on what you want to do or what 'traffic' is going through your router, and they are just set as 'rules' in your router menu. So I hope this gives the basics so you can understand more.
 
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that is very helpful pinks- You have opened the curtains!!!! Just needs me to get out of bed now- Figure of speech of course.!!!LOL

There is no need for me to access files on the main pc via my lap top from another location. I already back up via USB stick and transfer to the other- as the lap top is always with me-I always have latest version and a back up.Transfer to the main PC when back home.It is simple, it works and it is quick!

Music files are only ever placed on the lap top for the reason above.The shared folders are completely empty(on both) and so Am I right in thinking that the main PC is already well protected in this network or have i just closed the back door and not locked it?

As I only had those 2 items at the moment I may have appeared to be wanting to do everything but the question was really just for accessing the sling and dream via the laptop from somewhere else....that is all this network is for.

My ISP does not provide a static IP address. It is dynamic and so am I right in thinking this changes each time I log on?.If so how do i go about finding this out to log on remotely?

I dont have any extra networking software...just whats in the CP of Win XP

The paragraphs on the ports is great m8...whereas theres still a way for me to go you've put the four corners in for me (I do like a metaphor....joke). At least it has now clicked how all this stuff communicates with each other even if i dont yet know how to configure.

My only big concern is making this secure so that only myself and a chosen few maybe
can access it.;)
 
ok forget the xp wizard & forget extra software for networking because none of that will be relevant for what you want. As for security you are already fine, just have a firewall installed on your pc & laptop (or antivirus/internet security) and thats enough security for them. Your router is a hardware firewall for your network (a solid wall) and then you have your usual software protection on top of that, so if you arent setting any 'rules' for access to your pc then no need to worry on that side.

Dont worry so much about being secure, as standard and 'out of the box' you are secure to have your own network running, its fine. When you start changing things and settings port rules then thats when you re-consider security. Its like you start with a strong wall then add a 'doorway' so you just need to add a lock to the door. Mostly nobody will know where your 'wall' is, they wont know you have fitted a 'door' (u like metaphors lol) and then they wont know how to get round your security lock. Dont worry yourself too much.

I was thinking, the slingbox also probably comes with software so I'd say that will be easier to set up than this all sounds, but how it all works will still be the same.

As for Dynamic IP. While switched on your router stays connected to the internet provider. You can restart your computer or switch off etc as many times as you want but you will still have the same IP. If you turned your router off then when switched back on again it would re-join the internet provider and get a new IP. Some routers work by USB so before anyone says i'm wrong I realise restarting your pc will make you get a new IP, but thats because the usb router losses power. Anyway, you can set up a free 'dyndns' address to solve this problem. What this does is give a web-address that you can go to rather than an IP number. So use a 'name' rather than a 'telephone number' like- _http://bert.dyndns.eg
Your router re-connects to your internet provider & gets a new IP, it then sends the IP to your dyndns server and your 'name' is updated, so you can always connect to the right place. You can set this up for free, maybe visit- dyndns.org if you want to read more, but again its nothing major to understand.
 
Top Man Pinks.....

I have been in the habit of turning the power to the router off. It was simpl a glorified modem after i abandoned my previous dream effort. As this now needs to stay on 24/7 to work that solves that little prob-I had honestly overlooked this LOL - Up until yesterday I was still under the impression the main pc needed to stay on..hence I really was confused.

I dont use the modem usb option -use the asdl direct method -isnt it much quicker to use asdl option anyway?

Will look into dyndns as you say....would it now be wise though not to use the exact same naming as you suggest or did I miss the point...? Realise the numericals will stillbe changing in the background....

Thought you said you were no expert?- looks like you're the main man from where im standing !!
Cheers
 
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Im almost there!

unbelievably ive managed to network a slingbox into my set up....

I can access everything via the lap top and all functionality works fine....but im accessing it from within my lan.

I have created a dyndns address and was wanting to try and access as if from outside...

I have password protection enabled for port 80 of my router and when i type in the web address the pc asks me for a user name and password-

Is this the info for the router ,the dyndns site or whatever? Ive tried my passwords and cant get no further,cheers

Bert
 
why not just get a wireless network for the laptop, wont this be better, you dont really want a wire hanging of your laptop do you?
 
Hi...fisal - what i meant was i was trying to test my connection from outside the lan

idea is i take my lap top with me an access my doggybox from anywhere via internet....
-the lappy is just in for now to test ive set it all up ok.


so in terms of the wired network its all fine m8.....just that final bit of the jig saw to access it remotely...via a dyndhs address.
 
ok well done Bert glad you are getting there. Now I am not sure that putting a password on port 80 is the right thing? It may be but i dont know why, so how did you work this bit out, was it the slingbox instructions? Doesn't the slingbox have 'client' software that runs on your laptop, or can you just use your internet browser? If it is definately port 80 and just uses an internet browser then you should just need to set a port-forward rule in the router. Basics of 'rule' needs to be ~incoming traffic only on port 80 to go to 192.168.1.3 or whatever your slingbox internal IP is set to. Then the password box/prompt will be the password settings of the slingbox.

Now as i understand, if you type the dyndns addy in your browser you get a password prompt, but your passwords dont work, is that right? If so then it seems like the router is not allowing the connection to the slingbox, so it may mean that the 'rule' is not set up to go to the slingbox it may be going somewhere else (even the router itself). I dont have a slingbox so i am not sure how the instructions say to set it up or what port it uses. What might be best is if you pm me the make & model of your router then i could tell you how to set up a temporary 'door' that would allow all relevant traffic to go to the slingbox and you would get instant working results (hopefully), then once working you could work backwards..... that may not sound easy to understand sorry, but i mean stay fully open for about 20 mins until you close the unwanted/un-needed paths.

If you want to get technical then what i am saying is set up a DMZ server on your router to the slingbox, then once working you can find the port used, then you can set the single rule to do the same thing, then you can close the dmz server.

Finally, you have my email addy so dont be afraid to ask for help ;). I realise you want to keep details very private & secure so i wont need to know anything personal, but I also dont want you to write anything personal on the open forum so it may be best that i help by email. Threads are always useful & it means others can help out or gain solutions, but sometimes it comes to a point where you cant post exact relevant details.

Regards m8.
 
Thanks again m8....

I have my fixed address instead of the dynamic ip address too....

It looks like you may have to enter this address within the sling software- on any pc you are using to gain access to the sling. It gives the impression it goes through slings server too (from some auto settings/nothing to do with my manual config)......

(I had been trying to put the ad direct in the browser)

The slingbox has a specific box number which it now looks when the correct option in settings is ticked the pc sends a message to slings own server-Find this item on the internet -and its all automatic. There is an advanced function underneath with (Direct Connection) in brackets which has fields for input of the details we have been speaking about.

so goin to a m8s to see if i can access.-nothing like trying to make it as realistic as possible-I cant tinker with it once im there-(unless i set up shared folders I suppose)

With regard to the port situation- it looks like my router had that setting defaulted-i'd never been in that option before....but that brings me back to the question
What is the password.......? I haven't created one and the username and password of the router are not right either.......

may be worthwhile just turning it off for a bit whilst i try this out.
 
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