Sensible Topic The Gaza-Israel thing

Him Her

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It's a complex situation but most people just don't seem to get it. I've tried to summarise as best I can...

Arab-Israeli Conflict Timeline

Pre-WWII: various countries persecute Jews
WWII: Hitler persecutes Jews

Hard-line Jews (Zionists) emigrate to adopted homeland of Palestine. At this time Palestine is a multicultural, largely Muslim place with people from a variety of places in Africa.

1947: with British Mandate in Palestine nearing an end following WWII they put a proposal to the UN to 'partition' Palestine to provide a homeland for the Jews, possibly a sympathetic reaction to the holocaust, Jerusalem to be shared, Gaza and the West Bank to be left to the Arabs. The Arab States oppose this. UN creates Israel anyway. Both sides claim Jerusalem as their Capital city.

1948: British leave Palestine, Arab States attack Israel but US-funded Israel repels the attack. Israel expands borders. Arab States learn US lesson and fund anti-Israel organisations.

1949-1963: Lots of Palestinians, Israeli, Jordanians (and many others probably) shoot each other.

1964: Palestinian Liberation Organisation formed with the principle aim of destroying Israel and creating an 'independent Palestinian state'. Possibly funded by Egypt.

1967: Israeli 6-day war. Israel attacks Egypt due (allegedly) to Egyptian military buildup on Israeli borders, conflict escalates and Israel defeats Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq and a variety of supporters. Arab States declare no recognition of Israel, no peace and no negotiation. Israel expands borders.

1968-1979: PLO, Israel and most everybody else in the area attacks pretty much everyone else.

1980-1984: First female suicide bomber (Syrian); more people from all sides shoot people from any side.

1985: Leon Klinghoffer (Jewish-American) shot by Palestinian Liberation Front while sat in his wheelchair celebrating his 36th wedding anniversary. Hamas formed from Gaza wing of Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood.

1986-1990: Lots more people from all sides shoot each other. Palestine claims Israel shot over 1000 Palestinians, observers claim many Palestinians shot each other. Others claim Israeli snipers shot most and denied responsibility. Israel expands borders.

1991- Present: US continues to provide more aid to Israel than any other country/state; Palestinians continue to shoot anyone who disagrees with them; Mossad (Israeli) agents continue to kill Palestinian sympathisers throughout the world; Arab States continue to fund anti-Israel groups.

So, who is right? Not a bloody clue...

You may prefer the animation.

Israel and Palestine An Easy Animated Explanation - YouTube

Admin note: some posts have been removed from this thread.
 
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Must admit i dont know the full history but it sure is varied and colourful.I have spent a fair bit of time in Israel during my 2 visits fighting in Iraq.. must say i support the Israelis but not happy with the killing of the innocents,yet it seems most of Palestine is a pure hornets nest of fundamental terrorists..If you look back in history you will see at one point it was all now what is Israel..there will never be true peace until it is completely unified.
This is only my daft opinion and in no way an insult or belittlement of anyone/thing.
 
In my opinion Israel have overstepped the mark this time, yes there is a right to defend yourself. Israel could quite easily stop this by lifting the blockade on the Gaza strip, as well as pulling out of the West Bank. On this occasion, I can really see no difference between Israel and Russia!

I do believe the mentality of the middle eastern countries is 200 years behind the civilised world, but the trouble is the weaponry those guys have access to is proving to be to powerful for them.

Sticks and stones should be their weapon of choice.

Blunt yes, but those are my thoughts!
 
I sometimes think that the strategy of Hamas is quite cynical. Whenever Gaza has been out of the world news for a while, they start firing rockets into Israel to provoke them into over-reacting. That puts the Palestinian problem back at the top of the world news and the inevitable destruction and civilian casualties create sympathy for their cause.

In hindsight, the creation of Israel in 1948 may have been a mistake, but I can understand why it was done after what the Jews suffered under the Nazis. Trying to undo history is not going to solve anything now, so the two sides have to reach some compromise eventually.
 
Have you followed the recent events?

Three Isreal kids murdered in the west bank, Isreal blamed Hamas even though no evidence and WB controlled by Fatah and Isreal. Before this Palestinian reconciliation which Isreal opposed.

As result of murders, Isreal rounds up everyone released in the Giled deal and to derail the reconcilliation- rest as they say is history.

I don't believe in a million years Isreal will leave WB. All the water resources are they.

If I was Palestinian I would say fook it annex and give me full rights that will put expose the isreal and hopefully a just result

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
 
I don't think that the murder of the three kids led to the current situation. What annoyed Israel (correct spelling) was the random firing of rockets from Gaza. If you pull a tiger's tail, it will turn and bite you.

By the way, not all Palestinians left when Israel was created. Currently, about 20% of the population is Arab.
 
Obviously wrongs on both sides, but as long as Israel continues to defy International Law and occupy and settle land on the West Bank that doesn't belong to it, then nothing is ever going to be resolved.

It's interesting that the USA, which was Israel's staunchest ally, is now losing patience with them. I'm also noticing that British Jews, on the forums I belong to, are sickened by Israel's present behaviour.
 
It's a complex situation but most people just don't seem to get it. I've tried to summarise as best I can...

Arab-Israeli Conflict Timeline

Pre-WWII: various countries persecute Jews
WWII: Hitler persecutes Jews

Hard-line Jews (Zionists) emigrate to adopted homeland of Palestine. At this time Palestine is a multicultural, largely Muslim place with people from a variety of places in Africa.

1947: with British Mandate in Palestine nearing an end following WWII they put a proposal to the UN to 'partition' Palestine to provide a homeland for the Jews, possibly a sympathetic reaction to the holocaust, Jerusalem to be shared, Gaza and the West Bank to be left to the Arabs. The Arab States oppose this. UN creates Israel anyway. Both sides claim Jerusalem as their Capital city.

1948: British leave Palestine, Arab States attack Israel but US-funded Israel repels the attack. Israel expands borders. Arab States learn US lesson and fund anti-Israel organisations.

1949-1963: Lots of Palestinians, Israeli, Jordanians (and many others probably) shoot each other.

1964: Palestinian Liberation Organisation formed with the principle aim of destroying Israel and creating an 'independent Palestinian state'. Possibly funded by Egypt.

1967: Israeli 6-day war. Israel attacks Egypt due (allegedly) to Egyptian military buildup on Israeli borders, conflict escalates and Israel defeats Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iraq and a variety of supporters. Arab States declare no recognition of Israel, no peace and no negotiation. Israel expands borders.

1968-1979: PLO, Israel and most everybody else in the area attacks pretty much everyone else.

1980-1984: First female suicide bomber (Syrian); more people from all sides shoot people from any side.

1985: Leon Klinghoffer (Jewish-American) shot by Palestinian Liberation Front while sat in his wheelchair celebrating his 36th wedding anniversary. Hamas formed from Gaza wing of Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood.

1986-1990: Lots more people from all sides shoot each other. Palestine claims Israel shot over 1000 Palestinians, observers claim many Palestinians shot each other. Others claim Israeli snipers shot most and denied responsibility. Israel expands borders.

1991- Present: US continues to provide more aid to Israel than any other country/state; Palestinians continue to shoot anyone who disagrees with them; Mossad (Israeli) agents continue to kill Palestinian sympathisers throughout the world; Arab States continue to fund anti-Israel groups.

So, who is right? Not a bloody clue...

You may prefer the animation.

Israel and Palestine An Easy Animated Explanation - YouTube

from your timeline you are missing that the British were bombed out of there by the so called Zionist .. one such atrocity King David Hotel bombing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Pre-1948, which is a key date. i tried to keep my timeline as unbiased as possible but I may be wrong?
 
Pre-1948, which is a key date. i tried to keep my timeline as unbiased as possible but I may be wrong?

There were significant events before 1948:

Late 19th century - Zionist Jews began emigrating to Palestine (which was then part of the Ottoman Empire) and buying land.

1914-18 war - The British support an Arab revolt against the Ottoman Empire. The revolt is led by Lawrence of Arabia, who promises the Arabs an independent state. Whether such a pan-Arab state could have held together is another matter, considering subsequent religious and ethnic disputes in Lebanon, Syria and Iraq.

1917 - The British Foreign Secretary, A.J. Balfour, declares his support for the establishment of a "national home" for the Jewish people in Palestine.

1918 - At the end of the war, the British let down the aspirations of both the Arabs and the Jews. Under the Sykes-Picot agreement (secretly made by the Allies in 1916) the Arab provinces of the defeated Ottoman Empire are divided into zones of British and French rule until such time as they are able to govern themselves; Palestine is part of the British zone. That agreement is subsequently endorsed by the League of Nations as a 30 year mandate, to expire in 1948.

1918 - 1948 - Jewish immigration to Palestine continues, particularly after 1945.

It is no wonder, therefore, that the place is now such a mess.
 
Which ever side of the fence you sit I just have to say .. how fcuking stupid are Hamas ? 3 hours into a cease fire and they are kidnapping and killing Israeli soldiers, what do they expect then

Until the decent Palestinian people get rid of Hamas there is no chance of peace

Always the innocent suffer
 
Just watched a video of the shelling of a Red Crescent ambulance in Gaza from yesterday... At the very least the UN needs to stop pussying about and get blue helmets on the ground.
 
Just watched a video of the shelling of a Red Crescent ambulance in Gaza from yesterday... At the very least the UN needs to stop pussying about and get blue helmets on the ground.

If that's a joke it's in poor taste...

The job of the UN is to go in and provide humanitarian assistance given that it is safe to do so. Would YOU toddle into Gaza with a few bandages and bottles of water? Reality check M8!

Sorry, no offence intended :(
 
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Ditto. FYI peacekeepers would be there to enforce the cease fire, not repeat the errors of Iraq/Afganistan.

At the risk of offending an admin...have you not read my other posts? The UN have NO power to enforce a ceasefire; the Arab States absolutely HATE Israel; HAMAS is the personification of the Arab States hatred; the Jews have NOWHERE else to go ffs!

You would go in and wave a white flag???
 
At the risk of offending an admin...
Takes a bit to offend me, and you know what they say about opinions ;)
have you not read my other posts?
Other posts in this thread? Yes.

Other posts around the forum on this subject? No.
The UN have NO power to enforce a ceasefire;
Then my understanding of what the UN Peacekeepers do is confused by their own guiding principles:
http://www.un.org/en/peacekeeping/operations/peacekeeping.shtml said:
UN Peacekeeping is guided by three basic principles:

  • Consent of the parties;
  • Impartiality;
  • Non-use of force except in self-defence and defence of the mandate. (my emphasis)
I appreciate that the consent of the parties might be the sticking point in this instance, but if the mandate was to maintain a ceasefire...
the Arab States absolutely HATE Israel; HAMAS is the personification of the Arab States hatred; the Jews have NOWHERE else to go ffs!

You would go in and wave a white flag???
I said nothing about the Arab States or Israel. I didn't even apportion blame to the shelling.
 
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